What Ironman Training Taught Us About Building Wealth

What happens when your passion for building collides with a market that won’t sit still? We dive straight into that crossroads—balancing a love for real estate and entrepreneurship with the realities of higher insurance, stubborn taxes, softening rents, and even a surprise sewer moratorium that freezes permits in a prime Maryland corridor. Along the way, we lean on the same mindset we use to train for 70.3 races: clear goals, steady inputs, and a willingness to pivot when conditions change.

Underneath it all is a conversation about freedom numbers and lifestyle creep. We’re honest about what it really takes to feel secure, why health goals keep our discipline sharp, and how to pick strategies that fit your risk and season of life. If you’re weighing whether to buy, build, or borrow, this one gives you a practical framework and the trade-offs we’re making ourselves.

Transcript

Who Are We As A Show

SPEAKER_02 0:00

Welcome to the Everyday Millionaire Show with Ryan Greenberg and Nick Kalvis. Alright, welcome back to another episode of the Everyday Millionaire Show. We are here with Nick and Chase doing an internal. Chase and I had a meeting today. Nick had a meeting today, but he wasn't there. We had a little brainstorming meeting about the podcast and kind of the direction that we want to go. And um I don't think we know what direction we want to go.

SPEAKER_00 0:31

No, I I I think we talked a lot about um real estate investing, being entrepreneurs, the lifestyle behind being entrepreneurs. We talk a lot about triathlons, but I think fitness in general. Um so I I think there's like a mixed bag there, but I think people will just be able to relate to the life behind the scenes of what we're all doing and kind of like I like I was talking about you. Some some days you're pulling back from investing in real estate and focusing more on your business. And I think that's good insight for other people too, to be like, oh, should I pull back on investing too?

SPEAKER_02 1:02

Certain parts of investing, but like we're buying land like crazy right now. Right. We're just we're changing and dynamic, you know, dynamic in the in the world of investing, I would say. But I mean the the real the podcast started as a real estate podcast, and then it kind of like transformed, and we have guests on that aren't necessarily in the real estate space. So we were talking about like what are we as a podcast, and like some of it's just like we like talking about like the lifestyle we live and the lifestyle that real estate investing kind of created for us.

SPEAKER_01 1:29

Yeah. I mean, I think it'll always be around real estate and business, and then obviously the audience can see, like you said, what we've created around that as well, and then how you guys started to do the Iron Man and all that.

SPEAKER_02 1:40

And I think just like people like to see other people doing like epic shit. Like we were just talking about the trip to Costa Rica, like you travel a lot and post you know, when you're traveling and stuff, and Chase lives a life that most 28-year-olds don't get to live. So I feel like people like that, they like to see that, and they want to relate, like they want to have that relationship with like the people that are doing that stuff, so they can eventually do that same stuff.

Fitness, Triathlons, And Motivation

SPEAKER_00 2:07

Yeah, content's hard, man. And and podcasts I think are a cool like intermediate for content because we can kind of just talk about things and not feel so scripted and polished. And I that's what I was getting at today on the meeting, is like let's just be authentically us, you know, and I think people will enjoy that. You brought up like Joe Rogan is just him, and he has on many different guests, and there's not like one topic that he only talks about. And I mean, honestly, I think that's kind of you know, I'm not comparing us to Joe Rogan, but I mean that's what we do.

SPEAKER_02 2:38

We talk way better than Joe Rogan.

SPEAKER_00 2:40

We talk about a lot of things, and um, I and I think we just continue to do that, and I think that's what we're about to do today.

SPEAKER_02 2:45

Yeah, yeah, I think and we're so lucky to have Carl and Eric too. Like, with they're just like so dedicated to figuring it all out, yeah. And like I don't have the time to sit and do what Carl does, and like we were talking about all like some of the posts that he posted are like crazy, like just wild stuff like from the news or whatever, and they'll get like five million views, yeah. And like that's like not even content that's any real not related to anything that we do, but it works.

SPEAKER_01 3:15

So yeah, I mean I think the consistency aspect is kind of what helps, and I always see I always you know get the notifications and like they're going back and forth in the in the messaging, like messaging each other, keeping everything like organized and on top of everything, which is pretty cool to see.

SPEAKER_02 3:30

Yeah, they're they're good. And and today we had like this whole whole brainstorming session, and we had like added a couple of things. I think we're gonna do like LinkedIn, we're gonna mix in a little TikTok stuff to it, and like and I don't think we're gonna change like the actual content. I mean, I feel like the content and the stuff that we talk about is like our lives. So our lives are business operators, real estate investors, we do triathlons or fitness, like all those things kind of wrap together. Yeah, and a lot of people, dude, like a lot of my posts that I do about training get way more like people hitting me up. Like the other day, I was in um Costa Rica and I was running at 4 a.m. before before we went fishing, and somebody texted like somebody that I've never spoken to in my life, messaged me saying, like, I was gonna skip leg days today, but seeing you running in Costa Rica while you're on vacation at 4 a.m. make me go to the made me go to the gym today. I'm like, sick. That's yeah, that's cool. I just had a positive impact in some on somebody's life by just posting, I'm in Costa Rica, it's 4 a.m. and I'm running four miles.

SPEAKER_01 4:30

Yeah, I mean, sometimes that that's all it takes is for some somebody else to like see some sort of motivation and get them to do whatever it is they're doing, whether it's starting a business, buying real estate, working out, it's all helpful.

SPEAKER_00 4:40

Yeah, speaking of motivation, Nick, when are you gonna sign up for a triathlon?

SPEAKER_01 4:45

I you guys tell me in the next one.

SPEAKER_02 4:46

2026 needs to be the year.

SPEAKER_01 4:48

You guys tell me the next one.

SPEAKER_02 4:49

Eagleman. Eagle Man. That's a perfect one. That's a 70.3? Yes. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 4:53

So you guys said a triathlon. You didn't say like half a iron. Like that's a little bit. It is a triathlon. Well, I understand that. When's rock call, right? Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 5:01

Rock haul is it's either um it's on my brother's one. I can't do it, so that's how I know. It's on my brother's bachelor party in April, or it's his birthday as a wedding in May.

SPEAKER_01 5:10

I I know I can do it. The only thing that I haven't done is the swimming part.

SPEAKER_02 5:15

I mean, you do live on the water. Yes, maybe it's a perfect.

SPEAKER_01 5:19

And this year, the water's been frozen for you know three weeks straight. I mean, I could have seen how long I can hold my breath from one side of the water, frozen lake, all the way to the other side.

SPEAKER_02 5:29

That wouldn't help you in this sport. Yeah, let's not do that. Um, but you do live in the perfect place to practice open water swimming. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 5:36

So and it's starting to get warm. I mean, next week it's gonna hit 70, which is gonna be oversight. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 5:42

I don't know if I'll do another triathlon at the end of the year after June. I think I'm gonna do a high rox. Um, probably like Chicago. Uh Ryan's rolling his eyes, but I think it'll be fun. It'll be what is high rocks?

SPEAKER_02 5:53

We can do a high rox tomorrow. We don't even have to train for that. It's an hour and 20 minutes.

SPEAKER_00 5:57

Not competitively. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_02 5:59

Like, weightlifting and and like different obstacles. It's like running and throwing a ball around and rolling.

SPEAKER_00 6:05

Pushing sleds. It's like different, it's kind of like a crossfit mixed with running. Uh it's for pe I'm not gonna say that.

SPEAKER_01 6:11

Yeah, but why you don't you're not you don't like that kind of stuff?

SPEAKER_00 6:15

Or is it just the uh um he d he thinks he's too good for it?

SPEAKER_02 6:19

No, it's not that. I don't want to say what I was gonna say, but I'm I'm gonna say this. I'm gonna say that I feel like Hyrux is something that is for people that want to get off the couch and train for something, but not train too hard. And there's gonna be like your killers and your competitors that like you know go out there and win, and then there's like most of the other people that are just straight off the couch that just wanted to do something, and it's like an hour and a half max or whatever of time that you're gonna need to do that. And I just feel like if I'm not gonna win that kind of thing, which we won't, then I'm not gonna go.

SPEAKER_00 6:56

So why do the triathlon? Because they're actually really fucking hard. I mean the half's not that hard.

SPEAKER_02 7:02

It's hard enough, yeah. But I just feel like pushing a sled around and running a couple kilometers and throwing a ball up and down.

SPEAKER_00 7:10

So my my pool to it is that I can do it with my wife and we can like be on the team together, and so now I can go and do that one with her and we can kind of compete.

SPEAKER_02 7:20

And I I'm I would do one. I'm not saying I wouldn't do one. I guess like the idea is like you're just not gonna do a triathlon because you have to train for a high rox. Like, that's a silly thing you're saying. Oh, is that what you're saying? Like the point that you're at now, like you don't need to even train for a high rox, you can just go do it.

SPEAKER_00 7:35

Yeah, maybe.

SPEAKER_01 7:36

Is that the reason why you didn't want to do another one at the end of the year?

SPEAKER_00 7:40

Not necessarily. I mean, we're doing two back to back. I don't really feel like I need another it's not back to back, but they're months apart.

SPEAKER_02 7:47

We're going to Puerto Rico next week. That's next week. The other one's in June. It's March to June. It's multiple months. Okay. All right.

SPEAKER_01 7:54

So if I if I go there, I don't have a nice bike. So like what am I gonna do about that? Is it like a nice bike? It'll keep up with the bike.

SPEAKER_02 8:01

Oh, I got a nice bike. I've done multiple half Ironmans on it.

SPEAKER_01 8:04

But did the new did your newer bike outperform your old bike?

SPEAKER_02 8:07

Of course, but I don't think you would be at the point where you would see much of a difference.

unknown 8:11

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 8:12

But could you go like is it faster or is it kind of like just better?

Nick Commits To Eagleman

SPEAKER_02 8:16

The bike that I have that it's my old Trecomonda, like it's a good bike. It's a good bike. It's a$4,000 bike. Like it's a good bike. Um, it has everything that you would need to do a 70.3, and it would be better than probably 50 to 70% of the bikes that are gonna be at that thing.

SPEAKER_03 8:34

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 8:34

Like the bikes that Chase and I have, it's like I hate to say it like this, but it's like a 1% bike. Like only probably f maybe 5% of the people actually have like what we have because they're just so fucking expensive, it's insane.

SPEAKER_00 8:48

But like most people are doing it, like we've seen people on like sh really shitty old bikes doing these races, and they're just I've I mean I've had people pass me on shitty bikes, yeah, that are just been training for years and years and years. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 9:01

So it's not, it's it is a little bit on the bike, but like when we I feel like the difference when you're talking about like a couple of watts and then the position that you're in, it's it's so minute for somebody that hasn't been that's not like super dialed in that you're not gonna really see that much of a difference.

SPEAKER_00 9:20

The reason Nick I bought my bike was because I was I was doing 112 miles and I wanted to be comfortable, and my bike that I currently owned was giving me knee problems, um, anything over 50-60 miles. So I wanted I knew going into the full Iron Man that was gonna be it was gonna be awful, and so I was like, I'm willing to spend that money on that, and it's gonna you know help me in the half Iron Man's as well with speed. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 9:45

So can I still sign up?

SPEAKER_00 9:47

Yeah, yeah, 100%. You can sign up.

SPEAKER_02 9:49

Yeah, yeah. What if I drown in the water? We have so many, and I have an extra tri suit for you with our logo on it. So I have I think I have two. Well, we definitely have Chauncey and Jim, who's my future brother-in-law. They're both first timers doing Eagle Man. James. James is a first timer doing Eagle Man. Yep. So we got a bunch of people first timers, and it's a perfect race for first timer because it's an easy swim, it's a flat bike, and a flat run. So it's like you get a really easy course, it's hometown. You could take your boat there, dude. Literally. I'm I take the boat.

SPEAKER_01 10:25

Oh, okay. This one, I thought this was the Puerto Rico one.

SPEAKER_02 10:28

No, no, no, no, no. The one in um in Cambridge in June. I take the boat and I stay on the box.

SPEAKER_01 10:32

I don't think they're talking about the one next week. I'm talking about that one.

SPEAKER_02 10:34

Oh no, you can't come next week. Okay. You don't wouldn't want to do that. Too soon or it's too soon, and it's an ocean swim. Like you don't want to drown out there for sure. Yeah, I wouldn't do that. You need to train. You need to actually train.

SPEAKER_01 10:46

I mean, it's it now, uh March, April, May, June, three months.

SPEAKER_02 10:50

You got plenty of time for the June one. And it's local.

SPEAKER_01 10:52

You can literally take the Well, yeah, I yeah, I can take the boat there, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 10:55

Yeah. I think that I mean, that would be a great first race.

SPEAKER_00 10:59

But you better do it now, and there's not a lot of places to stay.

SPEAKER_01 11:01

Oh, book the hotel?

SPEAKER_00 11:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:03

Okay. Send me the information.

SPEAKER_00 11:05

We'll get you at the time and I need to buy it.

SPEAKER_01 11:07

All right, you guys heard it here. Definitely need the bike. You guys better check back in in June to see how I'm doing. Make sure I'm not in the hospital or get somewhere.

SPEAKER_02 11:14

They won't let you drown. There's tons of boats out there. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You'll get rescued, but it'll be humiliating to you.

SPEAKER_01 11:20

I don't see I'll laugh at it. I laughed at it.

SPEAKER_02 11:23

No, we'll get you dialed in, dude. We'll get you dialed in. Um, all right. So he said it live on the podcast. He's gonna sign up. We're gonna send him a link. That's it. Next next. Eagle man, baby. Um, yeah, so that um Do you guys like to stay together? On the full, we did, but the halves we don't.

SPEAKER_01 11:42

Is that fuck each other? We're just calling.

SPEAKER_00 11:44

The halves are like, I mean, we're competitive.

SPEAKER_02 11:46

Yeah, we're a little competitive. But like that's what's good about it, too. It's like you're you're competing with your friends, but you're also competing with yourself. So, like, no matter what, at the end of the race, like we're all hugging and having a great time. But like, yeah, kissing a little bit of kissing, mainly on the neck or the cheek, but you know. Um, like the it is a truly like self-competitive sport, like you're competing with yourself. Like, me, I'm not going into Eagle Man competing with Chase, I'm competing with my time from last year. Like, I want to beat my time from last year, and when I beat Chase, that's just gonna be fun too. See, I knew it was coming.

SPEAKER_00 12:27

I knew that part. It's never a race that he doesn't want to compete.

SPEAKER_02 12:31

Nah, I I like but it is it's a competition. It is a competition, and and like, and we're we're in different age groups. We don't even really you know compete as far as age groups go, so it's I'm in a different age group this year than I was last year, which is even a harder age group. So we're getting old as fuck. We're old as fuck now. But it is um one of those things where like for a half six hours or five that Eagle Man will be like five hours and twenty minutes, is hopefully five hours and nineteen minutes or less for me. Um that I can do by myself, but like the full being by yourself for 13 hours is like that sucks. And I was very happy to have Chase, Ben, Matt with me on that run because I got into some dark, dark places mentally. Yeah, for sure. And if I didn't have you guys with me, I would have been uh I would have probably not I don't know if I would have quit, but I would have walked, I would have stopped, and I would have like bitched. Yeah, I would have cried probably a little bit, maybe. I don't know. My coach being there helped too.

SPEAKER_00 13:29

She had like some little treats for us, like in on the course, and um but today, as far as physically goes, that's still the number one hardest thing I've ever done in my life. Yeah, the full one, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 13:41

I don't think that they I mean I can't really think of anything that would be harder physically.

SPEAKER_02 13:44

Yeah, maybe like an ultra marathon because it's so like demanding on like one thing, you know, like you're doing like just running.

SPEAKER_01 13:53

Whereas that's a hundred miles, right?

SPEAKER_02 13:55

Well, anything more than a marathon, like a 30 mile run is technically an ultra marathon, but like really like a hundred mile run would be really difficult. But they don't also those like those ones don't have like time, a lot of them don't have like time limits. So you a lot of them are people are like walking up the hill and stuff. Like we're competing against like time too. Like we have to finish within a certain amount of time or you get kicked off the course.

SPEAKER_01 14:18

So oh, they do kick you off, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 14:20

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, they have sweepers, and every single part has its own cutoff. So for the swim, like if you don't it's two hours, I think.

SPEAKER_00 14:29

No, less than oh, you're talking about the fool.

SPEAKER_02 14:31

I think it was two hours or two hours and ten minutes or something like that for your time cutoff. So if you're out there for longer, you get and you come in through the swim gate and you were past that, they'll pull you off the course. And then I think from there you have like eight hours to bike, and then from there you have like it's like a 16-hour total time limit. That's for the half for the full. The full okay the half is eight-hour time limit.

SPEAKER_01 14:54

And then so for I'm just trying to like gauge the swim. So for the swim, they might cut you off after what, like an hour.

SPEAKER_02 14:59

I think it's an hour and ten minutes for the swim.

SPEAKER_01 15:01

And then how long does it take you guys to do the swim on the half?

SPEAKER_02 15:04

35 to 40 minutes. Okay. And if it's a fast swim like Maine, it would be like 20. I think I was like 25, 26 minutes. And is that fast because of the there's no the current, but the Eagle Man will not be it will Eagle Man will take us 35-40 minutes. That's like because there's you're going two ways with the current. One way will be faster, the other way will be slower. Gotcha.

SPEAKER_00 15:26

I'd love to do Chattanooga. Chattanooga again. Yeah, but not have actually canceled. Yeah, actually swim because it's downriver too. Uh and the run, I mean the bike course is so fast. It's fun. The bike course is full.

SPEAKER_02 15:37

Yeah, I would do that race again. I was just disappointed that we went all the way down there and didn't get to swim. Yeah, that did suck.

SPEAKER_01 15:42

But Puerto Rico's gonna get to everything else. They did the the running.

SPEAKER_02 15:45

The bike and the run, yeah. Um, Puerto Rico's gonna be sick because we're like run, we're swimming over like coral reefs and stuff. Like you're gonna see like life out there. Um that's I I'm excited for that. And then the the bike is like along the coast, so that's gonna be like beautiful. The run's gonna be brutal, it's gonna be hilly and it's gonna be hot as hell. But I'm just gonna pray my way through the run and be fine.

SPEAKER_00 16:09

Yeah, yeah. I'm not looking forward to the run. I I'm dialed on the swim. I think we swam a lot. Yeah, um, the bike I think is manageable because of the hills. Um, but the run is definitely gonna be hard for me because of the heat, and I just haven't been running enough. Yeah, to be honest.

SPEAKER_02 16:24

Um, so let's bounce over to real estate investing now that we just talked about this for a while. Um this is a crazy thing that's happening right now in Anderondo County, and luckily it didn't affect us at all. But and Nick, I'm bringing this up because I don't I know you probably didn't hear about it, but so we're developing a bunch of lots in Andorondal County, and Anorondo County just came out with this like code orange thing where basically a pretty good chunk of northern Anorondo County, they're shutting down all new utility sewer permits. So nobody anybody that owns land that's trying to build for the next five years cannot put a utility tap in because on the Baltimore side there's like an over like a overflow. So they're basically saying that anybody that's trying to build now that I'm thinking about this, I had a client call me to build them a house in Glen Burney, and I'm wondering if it's in that zone. But they're gonna they're saying for five years nobody's gonna get utilities. So for us, like we have Chase and I have no no no, I'm sorry. Chase's lot that I have with him is not in that zone. But I have the lot with Brett that's in that zone, and luckily the permits are approved, and then Joe Tyler and I have a lot that's in that zone that permits are approved. But if not, we would have paid a hundred thousand for the I think a hundred thousand for both of them, and we wouldn't be able to build for five years.

SPEAKER_01 17:49

That's right. So we're just stuck with so what you're saying is that there's a section that you can't do that right now because there's too much waste going somewhere.

SPEAKER_02 17:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 17:58

And it'll just overflow the waste area.

SPEAKER_02 18:00

Yeah, like the public like sewer line, and they have to like disperse it some in some way. So they have some in it's an infrastructure problem.

SPEAKER_01 18:08

So that's even crazier because there's obviously not enough housing, and then that's kind of limit the ability to build housing in in a certain area, so then it's like two different things that are like Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 18:19

And it's all right around BWI, which is like a very popular area too, like it's very densely populated. Um, so it's gonna affect a lot of builders and a lot of people that bought lots that were trying to build, and like just imagine being like a big builder and you just bought a lot, like a Ryan homes or something.

SPEAKER_00 18:36

Like, luckily those people can probably afford it, but like if you thought you were just gonna build 50 houses on a on a track lot or something, like you know, like the people that are developing up by you, luckily your house isn't in that area, but like I guess they could they could technically keep building the houses and just add the sewer tap at the end, right? You just build it all in, pipe it all in, and then add it at the end.

SPEAKER_01 18:58

Yeah, but like having that many houses set vacant for that long.

SPEAKER_00 19:01

Yeah, yeah, sure, yeah, yeah. No, I agree, but like it's probably gonna take you two to three years to build 50 houses anyway.

SPEAKER_02 19:06

Like the thing is is if there's no end in the site, like if they because they said it could be five years more. Like they said they were gonna build the key bridge in this many years. I haven't even started on that shit, you know.

SPEAKER_01 19:17

Like, true.

SPEAKER_02 19:18

So I I don't know. I I would be very weary if I was a builder to go start building houses, not knowing if I could if my future people that live there could take a dump. Yeah, that's not uh and I don't actually know this, but we can look it up. But like I don't know if they'll let you continue with the building permit if you don't have your utility permits passed because everything has to be done like sequentially, right? So like I don't really know how that works.

SPEAKER_01 19:43

Yeah, and squatters don't discriminate, they they'll take it without utilities, with utilities, they don't yeah, that's true.

SPEAKER_02 19:49

Have you had we haven't had a big issue with squatters recently. Have you had a bunch of knock on some wood?

SPEAKER_01 19:56

Yeah, no, um have I lately no, I feel like it's calmed down.

Puerto Rico Race Plans

SPEAKER_00 20:03

Well, so I'll tell you guys this. I have a listing, and it's uh property you used to manage up in um over near uh Canton, Patterson Park, but off a little north uh what is that northwest, I guess. Um, and here's the here's the sequence of what's happened at this house, ready? So right before we listed it, house got broken into, they got it for all its copper. It's like 30k worth of copper or some shit. He filed insurance claim, got all that fixed, still had to come out of pocket a little bit of money for the rest of the repairs. Got it on the market, had showings going. This is right after the snow had all sat on the roof and it was like six inches of snow. And then we had that one, I think it was like Wednesday or Thursday where it got to like 70 degrees, heated up, melted all that snow, roof started leaking. Boom, now we have a puddle of water in the roof. Roofers couldn't get out there to fix it because there's still snow up there. So then we had to wait a couple days. We ended up getting it fixed, whatever. Then I had a showing, was it two days ago or yesterday? The agent text me a picture, AC units going.

SPEAKER_01 21:09

What uh what neighborhood? Um You said about Patterson Patterson Park, obviously north.

SPEAKER_00 21:14

We'll we'll talk off. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 21:16

Yeah, I mean, you know, what I try to do to prevent some of that stuff, and it's not always a hundred percent preventable, is it was a private townhouse, right? Mm-hmm. I put a six-foot privacy fence. That's like one of the first things we do. Um, obviously, the last thing we do is install the AC unit, especially if it's in the winter, we won't need it until then. We still have the furnace running inside with the coil on top.

SPEAKER_00 21:36

He had a cage on it too.

SPEAKER_01 21:37

Oh, cage too. They'll rip it right out. I've seen them get creative. They they work around the cage. If it's a cage that goes around like this and this, they can steal everything out of it that they need, that internal component, and the cage is still there.

SPEAKER_02 21:49

Yeah, yeah. This cage was untouched. Yeah, it's crazy.

SPEAKER_01 21:52

And that's until you see it, you really don't understand. Even if people think, Oh, I got a cage on it, it's fine. I still I'll put a cage and I'll put a six foot privacy fast. With the lock on it. Um, it doesn't prevent it like 100%, but it kind of does deter them. They can't immediately see the in the in their view of what's back in that backyard.

SPEAKER_00 22:08

The fence is a good idea, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:10

Yeah, that's what I always do. I mean, it's it you you have to do it. Once you go through this so many times, it's like you don't want that happening.

SPEAKER_00 22:16

Yeah, so now I think Ryan's team is handling getting, you know, sending somebody out there, meeting the insurance people. I I won't go to this house because the first time I went there, and it's not in a terrible block. Just got mugged. But yeah, but the street that it's on is a one-way street, and it's just like kind of tucked back a little bit, so it's just like there's a lot of foot traffic right there. And when I when I parked there and went to go check the lockbox, dude, there's like three guys standing on the corner with a ski mask, and I like walked down the street to my car because they were all like looking in my Tesla, and I was like, Oh my god, I'm about to get my car broken into. But you carry that, right? Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 22:53

I was care, but like we want to do is actually shoot you, but I carry a gun too, but I don't want to shoot. Yeah, there's three of them, one of me.

SPEAKER_01 22:59

They're gonna want to if they come after you.

SPEAKER_00 23:01

Yeah, but like still not good odds if they all three have guns. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_01 23:04

So I mean it's not good odds if you don't have one and they all three have one.

SPEAKER_00 23:09

True, true. So nonetheless, carry when you're in the city, but legally only. Yes, legally. I was uh walking back to the city.

SPEAKER_01 23:16

Care about your life legally, equally, legally.

SPEAKER_00 23:18

This is not uh advice for for anybody who listened to the city. Yeah, no, not legal advice. But then that that happened, and I was just like, all right, I'm not going back there, so I refuse to go to that.

SPEAKER_01 23:27

But it's tough. So it was actually Shannon Smith's listing. I had a listing that was um it was it's the street, it faced this way in the street, and hers, it was next to an alley, and her listing was a couple houses in on the next street, and I was like, you know, viewing my listing, making sure everything was good. It just got staged, and I look out the window, I'm like, shit, the AC is missing. And that was the house that I'm referring to where they worked around the the um the cage, and I messaged her, I was like, Hey, you're not gonna like this. Somebody stole the AC unit at your listing here. I'm like, I would recommend that the owner put a six-foot privacy fence. That's what we always do, just to prevent stuff like that.

SPEAKER_02 24:03

Um also don't put the AC back until it's ready to like be sold.

SPEAKER_01 24:07

Yeah, I think they sold twice from that property. I'm like, damn, that shit that probably hurts for that.

Big Shift To Real Estate News

SPEAKER_00 24:11

So that and that's what we were talking about with the seller. The seller was like, hey, I'm talking to um Ryan's guys at you know PE and they're gonna um come put the AC. And I was like, whoa, whoa, whoa, like don't put the AC unit back, file the claim, file the police report, do your thing, and then get the money from the insurance, and then we'll just credit the buyer for the AC unit. And he was like, Well, won't that look bad and deter you know potential buyers? And I was like, Look, it could, but when they come and ask me, you know, what's going on with the AC unit, I'll say, Hey, look, we're in a spot back here tucked away. We're you know, we got hit with scalpers who are just trying to you know come through and and get whatever they can. Once somebody's lived there, we're not gonna have any issues. We had a tenant there for three years, never had any issues. So I think that'll like calm down like a buyer, but I mean, what what are y'all's ad opinions on that?

SPEAKER_02 24:56

I mean, I I don't think any buyer in that area is a homeowner, like a live in live-in buyer, so they're gonna understand that. Like, I think it's gonna be an invest in at that particular property, it's gonna be an investor that buys it. So if they don't understand that, then I don't know, probably not the right buyer, but I mean it c I think it could go.

SPEAKER_01 25:14

I mean, you know, low income may come in there and and somebody with low income may come and buy as the primary, but I would probably in that situation, I would have just cleaned it up, like clean up whatever they didn't take, and just say we're waiting for the AC to be installed.

SPEAKER_02 25:29

I would love to know this statistic and we can look it up though. How many buyers under the 150 mark are home are the homeowners? Like I feel like not a lot in Baltimore.

SPEAKER_01 25:39

Well, when I bought my first place to live, it was 125,000.

SPEAKER_02 25:42

Okay, me too. Mine was 155,000, 157,000, but this was in 2016.

SPEAKER_01 25:47

This is in 2020 2020, maybe?

SPEAKER_02 25:51

Yeah, so we're talking six to ten years ago. Wait, your first house you bought was in 2020 now?

SPEAKER_01 25:57

No, it was my first place to live in, like my primary. My first house I bought was in 2018.

SPEAKER_00 26:02

So you bought a ton of houses before you even moved out of my parents. Owned one. Wow.

SPEAKER_02 26:06

Yeah, you knew that. I bought my first house in 2016 and it was 157,000. I still own that today. But that was 2016, like that house now is not 150,000. So I I just I don't know. I just feel like that price point in that area that we're talking specifically is tough to sell to a home to a homeowner. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:30

I don't know. So back to like scams and squatters and such. Somebody reached out to like two days ago to Lupe in regards to rental property we have available. She's like, hey, somebody was reaching out to me saying that this because they they searched it after the fact online and saw our company and then called our number, and they were like, somebody reached out and said that I gotta send them an application fee, and da da da. We're like claiming that they were the owner. We're like, No, can you send us where you got it from? She's like, I saw it on TikTok. So it was like a lady created a TikTok, and there's like dozens of houses that she has posted with like full addresses and everything, and I scroll through it, and I'm like, damn, that is my house. And she like posts the full address, all the pictures that I posted online, listing it for$700 less than what we have listed for, and then she has a number at the bottom saying, contact this number for more information.

Baltimore Sewers And Builder Fallout

SPEAKER_02 27:19

Well, we just signed a bill, and I don't know if it passed or not, but I like put my thing in online when Mike Griffith asked me to, um, that makes forging a lease a felony in the state of Maryland. So should we have to follow up? We'll have to have Mike on again after session this year. Yeah, for sure. Um, there's a lot of bills that he's been putting up and um that are affecting us. So maybe even while he's in session, we can have him on. But uh the the one I think is a really good rule is forging a lease should be a felony. Like, that is forging a legal document with the right to live in somebody's home or somebody's at like somebody's big biggest asset that they own. And I was talking to somebody about this the other day, like on the property management side, I see all walks of life for clients, right? Like we have clients that own 20 properties and we have clients that have one property. The client with one property, that's a really hard place to be because when something goes wrong, like those people typically have other jobs, they have another mortgage that they live in and pay for. And if that rental income is not coming in, like they have two mortgages to pay for. Yeah, for us, like we have so many that if one property is not paying, it's not like gonna kill us. But if one person has one property and one's not paying, they're in a tough, tough position. And and I see it all the time. Like, people are telling me, like, I'm going broke because of this property, is sitting vacant. And I'm like, Well, we have two options. We can put in a tenant that's not a good tenant because we have applications, but like I'm telling you that they're not good tenants, or Jocelyn's telling you they're not good tenants. But if you want to pick one of these people, go ahead and pick them, we'll put them in there. If you if you want to pick somebody with a 500 credit score, then go ahead.

SPEAKER_01 29:09

But it's definitely worth waiting for the right applicant, the right tenant.

SPEAKER_02 29:12

100%. And I said, you know, you're gonna collect one month's rent and then they're gonna stop paying, and then you're gonna have a whole nother problem on your hands. And I don't know if you've seen this, but we've seen a slowdown in rents, like just in in filling rents. Yeah. I mean, filling rentals are hard right now, like really, really hard. It's been it's been a brutal, brutal process for and I would say like across the board, like in some of the nicer areas too. Um, winter's always slow, but like it's been super slow, super slow for tenants, and I think there's a flood of inventory. I think the people have less money in that bracket that are renting. I don't know. I I think and even Section 8, though, dude, like we're having trouble placing Section 8 tenants.

SPEAKER_01 29:58

And we're getting lower rent offers now. I placed um back last May or June, so whatever that is, eight, nine months ago, eight months ago, we placed a tenant. Same street, same layout inside, four bedroom, two bath, Baltimore County. We got twenty nine hundred dollars and some change for the rent offer, and we accepted that tenant. They moved in. January this year, January or February, we got a rent offer for$2250. Same street, two uh two doors down, same layout inside, same bedroom, bath count, same bedroom count, obviously when it pertains to section eight. Uh, and it was like six hundred and fifty dollars less.

SPEAKER_00 30:35

Make that makes sense with property taxes and insurance going on.

unknown 30:39

Right.

SPEAKER_02 30:39

That's the problem. Expenses keep going up and rents are going down. And that is um I mean that's a huge problem. Like our insurance, dude. Have you checked your property insurance, your homeowners insurance? Ours went up by 30 something 35%. Yeah. Like just at Benfield alone. We it went up 35%. Really? And I looked at my portfolio across the board because Benfield's not in this portfolio homeowner owner's insurance that I have. It's a separate policy. But I have all my like another a bunch of ones that are owned by PE properties in one insurance policy. And it went from it was six thousand five hundred dollars and now it's over ten thousand dollars. It's almost double. It's like it's like I don't know what the percentage is, but it's almost double.

Theft, Vacants, And Security

SPEAKER_01 31:25

That's just insurance. I know it's crazy. I mean, I see all these numbers, insurance, and and I follow taxes and all that. Obviously, for the taxes, I'll send it to Mailer and tax appeals to appeal that. If I see an if because I have a bulk, like maybe 20, I think 25 to 30 properties under one, it's Westfield. Yeah, that's who I'm with, Westfield. That that went up a few thousand. But then the individual ones, it's easier for me to see because if it goes over a thousand, then I'm just like starting to like get on the phone and figure out what's going on. I like to keep every property's insurance under a thousand dollars a year.

SPEAKER_02 31:55

Yeah, I mean the insurance, the dude, BGE when they're sitting vacant is crazy.

SPEAKER_01 32:01

I had a vacant in January, January, February, and it was like a thousand dollars. I set the thermostat on fifty-five, and for that same month it was still a thousand bucks. And I called BGE, I was like, hey, what's going on? I said, I I I have a vacant house, and I set the thermometer on, or the thermostat rather, on fifty-five just so that I didn't have to run a lot of energy. She's like, Well, that might be the reason why because you set it on 55. She said, if the house isn't getting warm, I said, That doesn't make any sense. If I set it at 70, the house will hit 70. Okay, that might be warm, but then it's going to decrease just as fast as it would if it's at 50. So I didn't really understand her point there. She was just trying to explain why it's more because I said on a lower temperature, and I'm like, that doesn't make any sense.

SPEAKER_02 32:44

Dude, our our office that we converted back to an apartment is a 750 square foot apartment, and it's been seven, it's vacant, nobody's been there, set to 60 degrees or 50 something degrees, and it's been 750 a month every single month. Yeah, it's absolutely insane. And I'm like, even my future tenant, like, how is my future tenant gonna afford to pay? Especially when they're running it, and right now they're gonna be paying an extra thousand dollars, an extra thousand dollars a month in just utility.

SPEAKER_00 33:13

BG and E try to tell me because this happened on my flip, that Olin that you had listed, and they tried to tell me that it was because there's no humans inside, there was no body heat, there's nobody warming up. I'm just like, brother, what are we talking about? You're you're an energy company talking about body heat right now. Body heat.

SPEAKER_01 33:31

You would need like a hundred people in the house to probably even make a difference.

SPEAKER_02 33:34

You would need a hundred people on spin bikes like every day.

SPEAKER_01 33:39

Like, what are we what are you talking about?

SPEAKER_02 33:41

Yeah, that's a wild claim.

SPEAKER_01 33:42

When I hear something from them, I'm like, are you serious? And then I try to compare it to like I'll pull up other bills of similar properties that are also sitting vacant, and I'm like, this bill, okay, I know it was cold, this bill's three or four hundred bucks, but why is this same property type, same, you know, same vacancy, whatever thermostat said the same. Why is it a thousand dollars? That's like a big increase from three to four hundred on this property to a thousand for this property.

SPEAKER_02 34:05

Dude, the the landlord game, the rental game right now is tough, man. I'm gonna just be honest, and that's why we've kind of shifted to a lot of the new builds, and like even some of the new builds I'll probably have to keep as rentals. This year I probably won't because I just bought those other two Benfield properties, but like we need to buy rentals to keep losing money on taxes, like having to cost SEGs and stuff. But like, as far as the game goes, if you're trying to get in it and make money, it's fucking really hard right now.

SPEAKER_00 34:32

Yo, so speaking of which, what are your thoughts on, and I'm I'm curious if you've seen this, but DeSantis down in Florida trying to get rid of property tax.

SPEAKER_02 34:40

That's fantastic.

SPEAKER_00 34:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 34:42

The thing with Florida, though, this is what I have to say. Everybody looks at Florida as this model of like, oh, their budget is so good, because they were comparing it to New York's budget, and they were saying how they have this many more people, and New York has the bigger budget, New York City has a bigger budget. And like, I am not for the socialist governor or mayor of New York, right? I'm not for that I'm a capitalist, but like they can't compare Florida to New York because most of the people that were from New York, that lived in New York, that worked for New York, like my dad is a perfect example, not for Florida, but for Delaware. But I know a lot of people that worked for New in New York for New York State as a police officer, as a firefighter, as whatever my dad worked for the railroad, which is a state employee. That state pension fund is paying those people a lot of money, the boomer generation, that there is a lot of them, and the New York State is paying them, or New York City, whoever whatever jurisdiction they work for, is paying those people, and all of those people moved to Florida. So Florida is just seeing the income, but they don't have the expense of paying those people's pension. There's not a lot of people that retired in Florida that are getting paid by Florida. Most of the people are transient transplants from other places from up north, and those cities are paying pensions and they're not seeing the money come back to New York because those people left. So you can't like there is some skewed data.

SPEAKER_00 36:13

It's hard to compare that. And there's obviously the tourism factor of Florida, right? Like MC, I mean, you know, you fly into Orlando, MCO's jam-packed all the time, right?

SPEAKER_02 36:22

That and they have the ports. So I learned this the last time I was down there. The ports of Florida for the cruise ships, the cruise ships pay yeah, so the cruise companies pay a ridiculous amount of money to the state of Florida to have their ports there. Like they're Florida's a bad example of like because they they do have great economics, like as far as like they're gonna get rid of the property tax. Their budget is always balanced, they have money and surplus, but all the money's coming from New York and Chicago and New Jersey, and all the people that snowbird or all the people that moved permanently down south and their retirements are from New York, so they're being paid by New York State or New York City, and they're spending the money somewhere else. That if they were in New York, that money would be coming back to the state, and you know, so that makes sense. I don't know. It's a it's a hard, that's a hard thing to compare. But like also, like if New York wasn't so damn expensive, people would probably stay.

SPEAKER_00 37:16

Right. Well, I mean, it's the same thing here, right? Like um we're we were talking about retiring here, and this is like one of the worst, it's like top five worst places to retire in in the United States, and so it's no wonder that people are willing to move down to Florida and and retire. But also, like whether I uh you know the weather me and you were just talking, Nick, about um being able to have some house to get down there in the winter.

SPEAKER_01 37:39

So we should buy it before they get rid of the property tax thing because then it's gonna go more expensive.

SPEAKER_00 37:44

I know that's what I was thinking here. So um definitely gotta make some moves soon because if they if they act if that does pass, I think he signed it. Um so it's like an actual like in motion? Yeah, it's in motion. At least from what my I was I was being told.

SPEAKER_01 37:58

I feel like that's huge. Like imagine like for me here in Maryland, imagine if they got rid of property taxes. That would like Oh my god. I would be that would like be insane.

SPEAKER_02 38:08

How much more money would I would love to calculate? I'll calculate that today. How much more money I would make per year if they got rid of property taxes? It would be insane. Yeah, it would be like you're catching up six figures, yeah, at least it would go wild. That would be insane. Yeah, you have a lot more property than I do. You'd be you'd be making like hundreds of thousands of dollars more, yeah. But Maryland will never do that, yeah. Unfortunately.

Rents Down, Costs Up

SPEAKER_00 38:31

I wonder if there's a way that they could do it, right? Because then people would want to buy and live here and invest here, you know? So like there's a big incentive to do that. It's just how do they recoup those tax benefits somewhere else?

SPEAKER_02 38:43

Well, so like I always look at Delaware as an like a question mark for me because I don't really understand how they don't have sales tax, but they have other things that people pay for. So like my parents' property tax is ridiculously low. They have a they have a pretty good sized property, like 11 acres, and they only pay like a thousand bucks a year in property tax, and they don't pay any sales tax. But they pay like$25 a month for like garbage pickup, and like there's random little things that's how they just pay for things that you might get free. Like a la carte kind of thing, but like that to me doesn't make up for low like crazy low property taxes and like no sales tax. So I don't really understand how that works. Like the state needs money to operate, and I I really don't understand how all that works. I'm not that I'm not like smart enough to ever figure that out.

SPEAKER_00 39:38

Well, I think to your point with New York to Florida, also Maryland gets a little bit of that as well because people retire and then moved down to Florida, but also you got to think about how many people are living in PA, Delaware, Virginia, DC, and come to Maryland to work, but then go home in those states, right?

SPEAKER_02 39:55

I mean, my dad moved to Delaware to get away from taxes.

SPEAKER_00 39:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 39:59

And when he did that, he also got away from paying income tax. Like, I I don't think he pays like on his pension or something. Like, I when he told me I forget what it was, but like the amount of money that he was saving just in income taxes by moving to Delaware on his retirement was like insane the amount of money it was like for for them, like in relative terms. But like that, um those states like they they do have a draw to them. Like, I think Tennessee, Texas, a lot of places don't have state income tax, which would be a game changer for a lot of people. So, yeah, I think Delaware sees the benefit of Maryland fucking up because people just move across the line. Like my parents live 1.6 miles across the Maryland line, so they can easily use anything in Maryland but take advantage of Delaware. And like you were saying, Chase, like people live in PA, Hanover, like my plumbers, most of them live in on the Hanover, like PA line, and they drive down here for work because their salaries are 1.25 times what they would be just over there, and they all they got to do is drive an hour south.

SPEAKER_00 41:09

Yeah. I mean, majority of Maryland's economics comes from NSA and government work, and half of those people live in DC or Virginia because it's unaffordable to live here and pay taxes and do everything.

SPEAKER_02 41:21

So they'll But Northern VA is crazy expensive too.

SPEAKER_00 41:24

Yeah, Northern Virginia is. They'll drive even further, though, dude. They'll drive like two, three hours to work. It's crazy.

SPEAKER_02 41:30

Yeah, that that is crazy. I mean, West Virginia too is a good example. Like people move to like Morgantown or whatever those little Charlestown or whatever those little like border towns are in West Virginia, and then they'll work in DC, make a DC salary, and go back to West Virginia, and and then West Virginia sees the benefit of that. Yeah, yeah. I mean, I don't know. Here's a here's an interesting case because like we have so many states so close. Like Florida's so big that like unless you live in like Jacksonville or up there somewhere, you're not driving another state to work. Yeah, no, true. That's like that that would be insane. But um, yeah, New York, I think the being so expensive. I mean, people California's seeing the same thing, I'm sure. Like, people are leaving California, going to Texas. Texas is able to then make these crazy rules and be really free because the money's coming from California, not from you know, not from their own pockets. I don't know. I I hate talking about this shit. Politics. It's just like I don't know. It's frustrating to me because I see us getting fucked as investors here and business owners here, and then you hear about like all these other states where they're just like take like with property tax going up, they just keep going up and going up, but nothing's getting better. Yeah. Like what the Baltimore City's getting worse, and like they're keep trying to charge us more money. So I don't really I don't I don't care.

SPEAKER_00 42:54

Well, like you go down to Northern Virginia and the roads are great. Like, as soon as you get into Virginia, you know you're in Virginia because the roads are smooth. But you go to Baltimore City and it's like you're going through Baghdad, and it's like, dude, what is going on?

SPEAKER_01 43:06

How are we? They have like a three-year plan, I think it is to increase you know real estate taxes over the next three years, X amount of dollars per year, X amount of percentage, and it's like, where's that money going? And it it's just overwhelming because then you see rent starting to come down, and then you're paying more for taxes, and then you're you know getting less cash flow in that scenario.

SPEAKER_02 43:29

Yeah. Um, okay, so for people trying to get into rentals now, what's your suggestion, Nick? Like if you want to, if you're trying to get into like building a rental portfolio right now and you have nothing but a let's just say a mid to high end job where you're getting paid, you know, I don't even want to say a number, but you're you have some extra cash, you can put it into real estate. Are you right now, as a new investor with no properties, going into rental real estate?

SPEAKER_01 44:00

Yeah, I mean I think the time is always it's always a good time to buy real estate. It just depends on what you buy it at, right? The numbers just have to make sense. And the numbers can make sense in any market. It's just about buying it properly from the front, you know, the the front end of the transaction. Um and depends on the strategy that you're looking for. If you're working a full-time job, you don't want to be involved in it. You might just want to put 20% down and just get a conventional loan and and just own that route rental property. Maybe it cash flows a little bit, or if you have a little bit more time to focus or hire a GC to do um a the Burr method on a property, that's another option. But there's no bad time to buy real estate, it's always gonna go up. Um and you know, the benefits, the tax benefits, a debt pay down, appreciation, and then the cash flow.

Insurance Spikes And Utilities

SPEAKER_02 44:49

But the tax benefits here, we have to talk about that because the tax benefits for somebody with a W-2 job is not the same as somebody that's a real estate professional. So if we we qualify as real estate professionals, we get a different tax code. We have a different if you're a W-2, we were talking about that with um Jeff. Like he, because his wife operates the management company of the real estate, they can write off passive, you know. But if you are working a full-time job, you do not get the same tax benefits as we do as profess like full-time real estate investors.

SPEAKER_01 45:24

So even if you take the tax benefits out of the equation, you still have debt pay down appreciation, hopefully. Statistically, over time, you will have it. And those two align with cash flow, you know. Oh, a lot of people look at cash flow and they might say, you know, we cash flow four hundred dollars or three hundred dollars or five hundred dollars, whatever it is, and think, oh, well, that's not worth it. But you really have to look at the long-term picture. Like, like I said, the debt pay down is huge, you know, especially towards the back end of you know that 30-year loan, if you're disciplined and you hold on to that property and and you just deal with it throughout that whole process and you know the appreciation over time.

SPEAKER_00 46:00

Yeah. I mean, for me, it's what game do you want to play, right? So is it a short-term game for you, like if you want if you need the cash flow, um, or is it hey, debt appreciate uh debt pay down and appreciation, then you're you're running that that rental property like a business and you're setting aside all that cash flow because you know you're gonna have repairs coming down the line. And like you guys have talked about so many times, you might have like a hundred, let's just make numbers easy, a hundred dollars in cash flow over 12 months, but then you had to replace the roof and you just wiped out all your cash flows, right? Six years, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 46:35

Yeah, but I would also ad I would also say that I wouldn't buy a property that I think would have high appreciation without uh cash flow. So I wouldn't say, Oh, well, I'm not cash loan on this property, but it's it has potential to get high appreciation over time. I probably wouldn't do that. I would make sure that it has like a good balance combination between you know appreciation over time and and that cash flow.

SPEAKER_02 46:59

I just think right now it's really hard to find that that property that does have both of those things because of rates being so high and property tax and insurance being so high. Like that, I just I don't know. So like I I'll just play the straw man of it because I'm still buying rental real estate right now. So I I shouldn't, you know, I'm not saying don't do it. Um I just bought a duplex for over a million dollars, right? Like I'm still buying rental real estate, but I do believe that there are better places right now for your money if you are not willing to actively manage that real estate. Like if you have to pay a property manager and you have to pay a GC and you have a job that you're making good money, I do feel like right now, my opinion is that there is better places to put it. Like having my money manager at Merrill Lynch, he's making me a lot more money than my rental properties are right now. Like if you put you know them side by side and you look at the actual percent gain, my Merrill Lynch account is growing at a significantly higher value than or higher rate than Yeah, but are you also putting a percent gain on debt pay down and appreciation? Yeah, I mean, I'm if I didn't do the math, so I'd have to really figure it out, but I'm looking at like big numbers on my how long have you been with Merrill Lynch?

SPEAKER_00 48:17

Like less than a year, right? I would love for you us to sit down and do a case study on that at like a two, three year mark and compare, right? Like actually look at what your where your Merrill Lynch account started and where it is now, and then okay, if we sold you all your houses, what is your debt, you know, versus your your proceeds?

SPEAKER_02 48:37

If we sold the houses, that's a hard thing to do because we I bought a lot of these places in when it like it was a different time.

SPEAKER_00 48:43

Right, just like you're buying stock at a different time.

SPEAKER_02 48:47

Yeah, but but it's just it's what I'm saying is like, yeah, I get it, but like did this is the last 12 months, like on this account right here, just this one account did 52% gain in the last 12 months.

SPEAKER_00 49:02

Right, but there's gonna be it's it's gonna lose too.

SPEAKER_02 49:05

It goes up and down, but like I mean, it's been going up. I'll just say that. Well, listen to this.

SPEAKER_01 49:12

In 2020, my e-trade account went 100% up, right? And I'm sure a lot of people did at that time, and it felt very cool and comfortable and like worth of shit. And it was easy to make money, everybody can make money, right? And then I lost it, right? I lost a hundred percent gain because I didn't pull it out. A 50% gain, it's it's almost impossible to maintain that for an extended period of time.

SPEAKER_02 49:36

But that's also why you have somebody like, and I should I gotta preface this with like you do need a certain amount of money to have a managed account. So, like, we'll start with that. But when you do get to that point and you have a managed account, somebody is actively trading my portfolio, like in and out every day, they're trading, like they are making moves based on the market being where it is at that day, and they're analysts, like that's their job is to analyze the market, look at the futures, and then make trades. So that's not you sitting there and betting on Dogecoin. It's a very different situation, right?

SPEAKER_00 50:15

And and that's why I would still love like your like year three that you've been doing this with Merrill Merrill Lynch, and they're still managing your money. Let's look at minus his fees and everything that he takes from it, where your portfolio is, and then after all of those fees, how much did it make? And then let's say, hey, we're gonna sell all your houses, take all the cash flow, which is gonna be really hard to find all your cash flow, but all your cash flow minus all your expenses, which is again gonna be really hard for you to probably track because there's been a ton of things that probably happen over the years of the property. But even just from where you bought it to selling it today, there's been a great run. And you're to your point of well, that was a different time. Well, that's how you buy stock. You it's all about time in the market in either of them. And I've always kind of been like heavier, and I think we all have on real estate versus the stock argument, it's just a balancing act. And so, like, if we're talking to the person that has 150k worth of money in there and it's liquid, where should they invest it right now?

Is Real Estate Still Worth It

SPEAKER_02 51:13

Yeah, well, and one thing that I do like about these accounts, like I can borrow 80% of that, right? So I can borrow against it, which is liquidable. Whereas like with the real estate, you can with rental real estate, you can't um pull HELOCs on non-primaries. So, well, maybe there's a product out there, somebody will correct me, but like I haven't found a good product that you can pull like equity out and use it as like a line of credit. Whereas this, I can pull 80% of that out at any given point and use it to buy real estate or use it to lend to somebody. Like I just did two loans. I'm gonna do like I can I'm lending those loans and making 15% and I'm paying prime. So, like, there's there's that aspect of it too. Like, there's other ways, I guess, too, to that point. Now that I'm thinking about it in my head, I had a meeting with Sean Magner here last week at this office and or two weeks ago, and he's paying 10% or 11%, depending on how much you put in his fund. And you are technically investing in real estate because he's doing loans for real estate, but you don't have to manage real estate or worry about people squatting or worry about this, like it's just a fund, you're getting 11%. So if you have 150k that you're willing to put in, let's just if it's 150k, you're getting 10%. You're making 15k a year and there's pretty low risk. There's still risk if you're secured or unsecured? It's secured, it's secured by the fund that has assets that you know are tied to the fund. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Um, but so there's it's lower risk, and you don't have to think about it. Like, I mean, I think about managing my properties, and like I don't really like it sucks. Like, I don't really do it anymore because I have people like a team behind me now, but like that is would be a terrible thing to do. Like to be that that'd be my full-time job. So Nick, it's your full-time job.

SPEAKER_01 53:09

Well, I mean, I Lupe handles a most a lot of it.

SPEAKER_02 53:12

Yeah, yeah. So, like it is, you know, we have people around us, but like for somebody with 10 P properties, even you can't hire somebody unless you hire a property manager, right? Like, you can't hire a full-time maintenance person or uh admin person with 10 properties. There's just no way that it doesn't support that.

SPEAKER_00 53:29

So let's pull back real quick on the Merrill Lynch thing, because I think this is super interesting that not a lot of people know about, but like when and and for the people that don't, when you say borrow against it, is your money still invested in those stocks? Yeah, so how does that work? So you're still making money, right? And you're borrowing it, and I mean you have to pay back eight percent or whatever prime is. So you're making money actively, probably at twelve, fifteen percent, maybe even more. Maybe even more, yeah. And so it's kind of like an arbitrage in that.

SPEAKER_02 53:58

Yeah, there's still arbitrage, right? That's my goal is to be able to borrow against it, and it's at an 8%, let's just call it an 8% annual annualized interest rate, right?

SPEAKER_00 54:08

Let's say you're making 16%.

Stocks, Managed Money, And Leverage

SPEAKER_02 54:09

And let's just say we're making 16%. I'm making an eight percent on money that's sitting in the markets, and maybe that stock goes up to whatever, maybe it makes 25%, maybe it makes whatever. But like that 8% that I'm paying just comes off the top of whatever I'm making. So, like, and it's eight percent for the whole year, right? If I only need to borrow that money against it for let's just say a flip, right? Three to six months, I'm really only paying four percent total. And that stock could have gone up 10, 20%. It could have gone down to zero, too. Obviously, there's that's the risk, obviously, in doing this, and then you get margin called, and then they'll have to, you know. So that's the bad part about it. If all the stocks drop down to a lower point than what your they value it at, like what your loan is, that's why I don't really borrow that much of it. I would never borrow the 80% that I'm allowed to, just knowing that if it dropped, if the stocks drop by 30%, they're gonna be coming, the bank's gonna be coming for me for a 10% margin call. They're gonna say, You owe us now, you have to put into this account cash, 10% of that. You know, if I'm borrowing 80%, there's a 20% um equity there, then they're gonna say, Give me money. Yeah, yeah. So there is that risk, but like right now the markets are very strong, and I like the fact that like I texted you the thing that George texted me the other day. Like, I just like he like makes plays for me and he he calls me. We talk on like maybe a weekly basis, and he's like, Hey, just want you to know, like, these are the plays that we're making right now. We're looking at futures in this, we're looking at making option calls for this. Like, like what kind of exposure are you looking for? Like, I was I'm always like, we are aggressive as fuck. Like, we're going aggressive. We're we have time on our side, even if the market dips, we're gonna buy more. Like, we have we have the um risk tolerance, like we're gonna go heavy. Then there's other people that want to go like soft, like they want to just they do want to do treasury bonds and make three, four percent guaranteed without any risk. But like for me, my risk tolerance is high, and I have time on my side where I don't need that money right now to operate my life. So I'm just like fuck it, go all in. And you I mean, you saw it, I showed it to you. I'm making 50% in the last year on that, just that one account. So, across all the accounts, I will we can do a case study and I'll pull some like uh statements. I don't want to say numbers, but like I'll say percentages. And I think that right now the markets are strong. Maybe if they crash, I would see saying something different. But honestly, I think if they crash, I would just be taking more advantage of buying more stocks. Yeah, I mean they go up over time, they they go up over time, yeah. And there's an interesting new thing that's happening with AI having like there's so much opportunity around AI between data centers, between all of the stuff that that they use for energy. Like, dude, Bloom Energy, I fucked up that one bad. I bought Bloom Energy at like$100 a share, and I sold uh options for it, and it went up to like$150 a share, like like shot up like crazy, and I got assigned, and I think I sold options for like$125. So like I made$25 a share on a couple hundred shares, but I lost the opportunity to make a lot of money, yeah. So I don't know that it's right now there's a push for the AI stuff, and if you have um somebody that's a money manager, we are not licensed financial advisors, so I'm not trying to give anybody financial advice, but find somebody that is and really ask them, and you should be doing this too with with like your money, because I will say, man, like I do feel a lot better about putting my money into this place where somebody that's really a lot smarter than me is managing it every day, than um the fact that you're just you know throwing money into real estate that like I mean I don't know, man. I'm my real estate holdings and the the new constructions are good, but like I'm just not seeing it on like the C class townhouse, Baltimore City stuff anymore.

SPEAKER_01 58:30

Yeah, no, it's it's definitely tough. That's why over the last year and a half, two years, I transitioned more towards flips because the night numbers were super tight, especially with the higher interest rates, six and a half percent refinanced on the back end. The uh the cash flow wasn't there, you know. People still want you know top dollar for their house that need a full renovation anyway, and construction costs are higher at the same time. So every with all those factors, it's like now is why I'm flipping. Um back to like you know, if I was getting into it now for the audience listening, I would even go and if you have time, go and search properties that were sold between 2020 2022 and see if those houses are on the market now, sitting or reach out to some of those um individuals if if you you know have an idea that they're trying to sell sell the property. I guess you would only know that if it's listed, obviously, because those are the times where they had low interest rates, and maybe that's an opportunity to get into like a sub sub two deal. Um that would be the only way that you know great cash flow now would exist if you were able to sub two somebody's you know low three percent interest rate now.

SPEAKER_00 59:40

But the problem with sub two though is there's too much cash to close.

SPEAKER_01 59:42

No, so like I was referring to going back to 2020, 2022, not much debt paying down in that many years.

SPEAKER_00 59:49

Yes, yes, yes.

SPEAKER_01 59:50

So maybe you have to pull the same amount that you would if you were putting down 20% on like a$200,000 house, maybe.

SPEAKER_02 59:56

Yeah, I also think like going into business right now in general, like I think that's a smarter play, like finding something that uh and this is only for people that like aren't making a lot of money at their job, right? I'm not talking about the person that's making a million dollars a year at their W-2 job, but like the person that hates their job, that's like in that middle income range and they're not happy. Like, I think going into business right now is the best play, like one of the best things to do because we have a whole generation of people that own like 90% of the businesses that are all trying to retire. Like, there's a lot of people, a lot of people that are our parents' age, maybe not Chase's parents' age, but our parents' age that are all trying to retire right now. And they are business owners and they can't retire, or they are retiring and just giving up on their business, or they're selling their business. And there's a lot of opportunity, I think, and we've talked about this before, and like the home services space, the contracting space, like um all that, all those businesses, man, like HVAC companies are selling for crazy multiples right now. Like that that stuff, I think. Um, again, I'm only talking to those people that like are at a job that they don't like, that they want to move and do something different. But I will say, I think active business and like starting something of your own right now, it's hard to do real estate like Bigger Pockets was talking about 10 years ago. It's really, really hard to say I'm gonna buy five, ten properties and be financially free, and that those ten properties are making me five, six thousand, eight thousand dollars a month in cash flow, and I can live off that. Yeah, like that is not realistic right now.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:35

And I don't even think that was even the case, even when interest rates were low. You know what I mean? I mean it kind of was. Yeah, I mean you get good cash flow, but can you really live off of cat good cash flow on on ten doors comfortably? Maybe.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:48

Well, I think I hate to sound like such a like some people do live off of six thousand dollars a month, Nick.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:58

Yeah, but I I think yes they do, but I think if they see that maybe a lifestyle increase may occur and they might spend more. You have to really discipline to like make a different form of income or make more income and then not spend more.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:15

Yeah, I don't have that. I have a disease. I was telling Chase that he almost killed himself on the bench press. I was it's like Chase, I think I have a sickness. I was bidding on watches last night online.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:27

I just started busting out loud, I was lifting. He was telling me I thought he was gonna tell me he was sick. I did say I was sick. Yeah, I thought you were gonna tell me like you're actually sick, but you're mentally sick, that's it.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:37

Yeah, yeah, and mentally ill. But no, yeah, I lifestyle creep is virtually for me impossible to get away from. Um when you have it, you want to spend it. But like I feel like as long as you have a certain rate of saving and investing, then you can allow that lifestyle creep to happen as long as you have like a standard of like for me, I'm investing more than I'm spending, even on my lifestyle that I live. So like I'm living a way crazier lifestyle than I was 10 years ago, but like relatively to what I'm making, I'm still investing more now than I was 10 years ago.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:14

It's kind of like the profit first model. I'm sure you do that more that you're like, I'm gonna invest this amount of money, but then I'm gonna play. And especially like doing I I know it's like it's crazy to think about, but my lifestyle creep has gone way up, especially when you start hanging around people like you guys that are six years ahead of me, right? And so like I have to really dial back and just make sure, hey, I'm investing everything um and and pouring back into the business as well. Um, but we work hard, like we work a lot of hours, yeah, yeah, yeah. And people don't always see that, and it's like sometimes you just want to enjoy life a little bit too.

Funds, Private Lending, And Risk

SPEAKER_02 1:03:51

So you have to, yeah. You have to. If you don't, and you're doing what we're doing and building these businesses and putting out the fires every day that we're trying to put out, like it will just burn you out to a point where like if I didn't get to enjoy going away on vacation all the time and buying cool shit and going race my car and all that stuff, like I wouldn't have anything to live for. Like, why would I work that hard? It just wouldn't make any sense for me. And I don't know, I just you know I hate to say it now in my position to somebody else that's like in a different position, but like Chase, you're a good example. Like, I at 28, I was not able to do the shit that you're doing now, and you're like you're making way more than you are than me when I was 28. So, like, and I had a bunch of properties, and I had you know, at 28, I was doing pretty well for for that, but like relative to what you're doing now, like you're doing way better than I was at 28. So, like just imagine where you're gonna be at 35. Like, I like that I feel like is um inevitable, but you do have to grind. What is okay? Let's ask, let's go around the table. I do have to leave in like two minutes. Okay, so quick question How much do you think is a enough money to make per month that would feel you would feel comfortable? Like this is how much I need to live my life and have fun, not worry about shit. What's that number?

SPEAKER_01 1:05:12

I'd say a hundred thousand.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:16

A month? I was gonna say fifty thousand. Oh, I guess I'm the lowest one of them all. I was gonna say twenty thousand.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:24

Okay, so yeah, a hundred thousand is a lot. I think with fifty thousand dollars, you can do you can have a nice house, you can have a a couple nice cars, you can have a boat. I mean you could do a lot of things with fifty thousand dollars in a month.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:37

Like without working. Because then you would spend more, right? Like if you don't like not working on anything. Because if you're not working, you're spending, most likely, right? Because you're gonna be doing more. I guess. I think at fifty it'll be kind of close.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:50

Tw you're you're saying net every month, how much do you need? Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:55

But if you're not but if you're not working anymore, right? Like you you don't you don't get you don't have to work anymore.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:00

Okay, I was saying you're working. I'm I'm in my world that I'm talking about this situation. You're working and you you're just trying to get to a point where you're not worried about money anymore. Yes. Gotcha.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:10

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:11

But you're still working.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:12

Stop dreaming, Nick. You're dreaming over there.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:15

I'm thinking because then, like, if if you're not if you have this amount of money every month coming in, passive incomes and you have all your time, you're gonna be out spending more money doing more activities.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:24

Yeah, no, but you're working. You're working the same lifestyle right now.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:26

Yeah, yeah. Like we're doing the same thing that we're doing right now. And I think fifty thousand dollars a month is is enough to work, like do whatever you really want to do within reason. Like you're not at the point where you're flying private, but like you can go away, you can enjoy yourself, you could do most things and not have to worry about it. You can go spend 10 grand on a vacation and not have to think about it. You can fly first class and not have to think about it. You go to restaurants, you're not looking at the price. Like that's where I'm that's what I'm saying. I'm not saying like you're Michael Jordan and buying a$30 million yacht on airplane. Nick wants to be Michael Jordan. But like even at$100,000 a month, you're not doing you're not private, probably either. I mean, I just feel like most people think like, oh well, if I made$20,000 a month, I would be financially free. But like Nick said, I think at$20,000 a month that puts you in the most vulnerable spot because you think you're gonna be financially free, but your lifestyle creep gets that's like my half of my mortgage.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:26

I mean, like that's like half of my mortgage is like that much. Yeah, right. I mean my mortgage is half of that much.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:33

Yeah, so yeah, and and you have a you have a nice house, but like every time I go to the racetrack, it's five thousand dollars. Like probably five thousand or little maybe maybe a little bit less. And like every time I go on vacation, ten, five, ten thousand dollars.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:47

I guess it just goes to show you where we're at in life, okay? You know, like yeah, once you see uh it there's levels to the shit. Um let's be real. Like once you get to a certain bracket, you're like, oh yeah, this this is it, and then you get to the next bracket and you're like, no, I'd I'd be really good if I was up there, and then you get to that bracket and you're like, damn, I'd be really good if I was at a hundred thousand.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:09

Yeah, so I I yeah, I think and my number, I'm putting it out there in the world. Like when I have I'm gonna save ten million dollars liquid, that's my number, where then I'm then I'm done working. That's my number, and still have my assets, my real estate, all I'm not counting my equity and my real estate in this scenario. Ten million dollars liquid, you don't have to, you could fuck off. You could put that into a fund, into whatever, and make a hundred thousand dollars a month and not have to do shit. And I that that's I think that's my number. That's where I'm that's like what I'm like okay, I'm I'm gonna be done now. Sell my business. Like that includes selling my businesses, so and I have to split it, so I have to make really have to make 20 million because I had to split it with Tyler. But that's where I'm like, fuck it, I'm done.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:58

What about just selling your rental properties and including all that in the 10 million?

SPEAKER_02 1:09:03

So the problem with that is is then I have to pay those taxes. Yeah. Because I gotta keep of tax haven somehow. So my thought in my head, I'm like, sure, I can pay I can sell my real estate and probably have close to that now. But what am I gonna do? I could sell my businesses and sell my real estate and probably have close to that now, but then uh then I'm just out then I'm just paying taxes on like crazy amounts of money. The government's coming after me for 50 fucking percent, probably 40% maybe. I don't know. That that to me is like I don't really understand how much I would have to pay if I sold everything, but I know I took like bonus depreciation on a lot of stuff and like the government's coming back for that, they want that money. So I don't know. I listened to Ben Mala, but he was he's recently talking about that on his uh I want to get him on the fucking podcast. I want to go down to Tampa and get him on the podcast. Ben Mala, do you listening? You're not, but if you were, if you were, we're coming for you. We're coming for you. Um all right, we before we go, we are looking actively for new sponsors for this year um for the Everyday Millionaire show. We have, I don't know how many followers we talked about today. God damn, how many followers do we have? We have a lot of followers now.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:13

I think it's 8,500 on Instagram.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:15

8,500 on Instagram, 25,000 on Facebook, 8 or 9,000.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:19

Definitely hit us, hit us up, DM us, uh, we'll get you over the stats um and we'll show you our recent partnership case study that we did uh with subdogs as well. Yep. Um and kind of you can compare. Um, but yeah, definitely if you're in the real estate industry, you're a premier partner.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:36

Couple million dollars, couple million views per month on content that will have your logo on it. Um for the last several months we've had multi million views on our on all of our and it's a it's a no brainer, you know.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:48

We're we're in the Baltimore, Maryland market. If you have a business in this area, it's it's best to utilize this opportunity. It's it's a great uh turnout, especially when we have the when we have events as well. You'll be posted up there and there's always a couple hundred people that stop by.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:02

Yeah. So hit us up. Thank you for listening. Until next time.