The Everyday Millionaire Show
The Everyday Millionaire Show
How to Master Sales, Cold Calling, and Human Connection - Phil Gerdes (Full Podcast)
Discover the incredible journey of Phil Gerdes, a dynamic entrepreneur whose story is nothing short of inspirational. From starting an online advertising business at 17 to sharing the stage with motivational giants like Robert Kiyosaki and Tony Robbins, Phil has mastered the art of reinvention across industries.
His experiences as a dance choreographer, real estate mogul, and motivational speaker offer a treasure trove of insights into the power of an abundance mindset and the importance of skill transfer. Get ready to unlock valuable lessons on leadership, innovation, and seizing opportunities in the ever-evolving real estate market.
If, five years from now, I'm still doing the things I'm doing today, it is no one's fault, but my own. It's a lack of leadership, it's an ego issue, because leaders should transfer skills, not aim to just create and then keep. Homes are going to sell next year, with or without us. No one here is changing that. If historical data speaks true, homes are going to sell, they're going to move. What should buyers do? Don't wait for 2025. I to move. What should buyers do? Don't wait for 2025. I mean, I do not understand when anyone says, yes, I could buy now, but I'd rather wait until next year.
Speaker 2:Can we paint the demographic? It's 50 year olds and older women realtors that have been in the business.
Speaker 3:You're going to be canceled after this podcast. So what I?
Speaker 1:want to do is I want to make clear that I didn't say that, because I'm not going to be canceled.
Speaker 2:I didn't say anything about the age or the sex of any realtor whatsoever.
Speaker 1:But you heard it? I didn't hear a thing.
Speaker 2:Welcome to the Everyday.
Speaker 1:Millionaire.
Speaker 2:Show with Ryan Greenberg and Nick Kalkas. Hi guys, welcome back to another episode of the Everyday Millionaire Show. We are here today with Phil Gerds. How are you doing, Phil? Good Doing wonderful, thank you. Yes, thanks for coming. It's been a long time We've been trying to get this one scheduled.
Speaker 4:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Back and forth a little bit, but we appreciate you coming on and getting it done. So we are in the same world in real estate, but I know you've done and do other things as well. So why don't we run back, I guess, just a little bit to like where you started, because you didn't start as a millionaire real estate guy. So I know you. I heard your story at another event that we were speaking at together. So, yeah, tell us a little bit about your story. You're going all the way back, all the way back.
Speaker 1:Okay, all right. So, 17 years old, started my own online advertising company, taught myself to code because when I was 17, you didn't have Wix or Squarespace. If you didn't know how to code, you couldn't build a website. So I taught myself to code, built a website, then I went business to business and convinced people to advertise on my website, convince businesses, business owners, to advertise on my website which is crazy when you think about it, because I'm a 17 year old kid promising the world to business owners and they believe me, they listened, um, and that worked for a little while and then I, uh, I went to college and then um. After that, I left school and then came back, moved to New York where I'm originally from. Um and then, believe it or not, came back, moved to New York where I'm originally from.
Speaker 1:And then, believe it or not, I was a dance choreographer. Oh, wow, yep, a whole nother life, wow. And then I jumped into the real estate world, owned my mortgage companies and did that for some time, got into direct sales for some time, speaking for about 15 years and own different companies printing companies, things like that and ever since then it's just I've worked. Ultimately, I've worked one year as an adult for, like another person, in a traditional style job. Everything else has been, as I say, kill what you eat, you know.
Speaker 4:So I know you said you mentioned you were speaking and that was before real estate, correct? Yeah? So what were you speaking before you got before real estate, correct? Yeah? So what were you speaking before you got into real?
Speaker 1:estate. What were you speaking about? I owned a company called Peak Performance Coaching, so it really depended on what you needed right, or what you brought me in to speak to your folks about. A lot of it tended to jump to a mindset space right and breaking through barriers. Others just were hyper specific to whatever your company was about. Like, I've spoke to tech companies, but I've also been on stage and like Robert Kiyosaki is walking off stage and Phil's walking on, Tony Robbins walking on stage and or or I'm walking off stage, Tony Robbins is walking on, so it's sort of just dependent on what the event was and and why I was there and things like that.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, and for speaking just in general, like, do you just need a compelling story and then people are? Or how did you get yourself out there to get people to want? Because there's, I guarantee there's a bunch of people that have cool stories, right, but not everybody gets to become a speaker like you did. So what were the steps that you took to get on that stage?
Speaker 1:I think I think the direct sales world really pushed me into learning how to speak confidently in front of a group of people. I've never really like I said, dance choreographer. I've never had a problem being in front of the masses, which is really odd because I'm very socially awkward, very socially. So if we all went out somewhere, like it's a Friday night, you guys are like, hey, let's go out, you're going to have a blast and I'm going to hang out on the wall the entire night. You're going to be like are you good? Yeah, I'm totally fine, but I'm just not going to be in the mix like everyone else is. Uh, but if you turn a camera on or if you put me in front of 15,000 people, man, I'm going to light up like that is my world, that's my space. So I think one you you kind of grow into this person, that you, you find your lanes and this is just really my lane, um. But also then you start studying your craft.
Speaker 1:You know, at at 17, I really developed an affinity for human psychology. I really wanted to understand why people do what they do and it's never left me. You know, 26 years later, I study it every single day. Every day I study human psychology. So I want to understand, like I want to know, why you ask the question you ask and what made you think of it and how long have you been thinking about it and why did you ask me or do you ask everyone that question?
Speaker 1:And then, like, what did you do this morning and what prompted you to do it? And is it a traditional habit or was it something that took you off your path? And if it took you off your path, and what happened yesterday that might've led you to get off that path and how will it affect you tomorrow? All of that because, ultimately, there's a milestone moment that comes and it's stacked by by micro moments. And how do we get there? Because if we can figure things like that out, then we can figure out what milestone moments happen from what micro moments and then we can create anything we want. So, to get back to your question, I'm I'm coming off. But to get back to your question can anyone be a speaker? Probably, does everyone become a speaker? No, because there's so much more than a story right I've got.
Speaker 1:I mean, I could tell you about my upbringing, I could tell you about challenges I've had, but that's all about me relating and connecting to other people.
Speaker 2:That's an art, you know yeah, that's like the sales number one thing like we were chasing. I were talking today about a seller that's kind of like really stubborn on their price of their house because they think their house is worth maybe more than what it's probably worth, and we're like talking about like he just wants a win, right like in his head, like. So we're trying to figure out like if we get him the number on the contract that says the number that he wants, but he has to spend fifty thousand dollars fixing the house as long as that end contract says what he said, even if the net is the same as what the other offer came in. Psychology says that he just wants that win.
Speaker 2:He wants to say I got that number for the house which is that's like half of sales, right yeah.
Speaker 1:I have something called the profitable persuasion method and part of it is called a value diamond and what it does is it breaks down the what ultimately other people value. And when you can establish and really ask the right questions to find out and figure out what someone else values, then there's nothing you can't do with that person. Like if I can. In sales from me, the number one key to sales is building a connection. So if I need to build a connection, once I build a connection, what I've done is established trust. How do I build a connection? I ask the right questions. Once I've asked the right questions, how do I ask the right questions? I do the research. So now I do the research. I've asked the right questions. I need to know how to have a proper conversation. Well, there's that's the four phases of effective conversation. Well, there's more to asking questions. There's more to having a conversation than just the words you say. It's how you say them. Well, that's the four obsessions of profitable practice. Well, this all lives in the profitable persuasion method.
Speaker 1:But now all of that leads to what facet of the value diamond are people in? Are they focused on health? Are they focused on wealth? Are they focused on leisure? Are they focused on faith? Are they focused Like, where are they? Well, if I can give you the answer to where your focus is, then I've figured out what you're moving for. And once I figured out what you're moving for and I don't just mean in real estate, but literally what your movement is for now I can move you without touching you. Now I become the catalyst for your movement. Move you without touching you. Now I become the catalyst for your movement.
Speaker 2:Well then, who's in control? Do you ever meet somebody that like, either you're coaching or you're trying to help, or maybe an employee or team member that you are trying to help and motivate in certain ways and you go through? Okay, maybe they're not motivated by money, maybe they're motivated by praise, but then you can't find something and then you're like well, is this person like a lost cause, almost like, can I actually help this person? Because there's been people like that that I've tried to help just in business, in exercise, in different things, and some people take it and they use it and they actually put it into play and then other people like will either just make excuses on why they're not exercising or why they're 400 pounds overweight or whatever the whatever the situation is, do you ever find that where you're just like well, this person's not this, they don't have it?
Speaker 1:yeah, um, I do. I think that for me, I probably, like my staff, gets on me a lot because I'm I'm very insanely empathetic, which is a dis. I do myself a disservice because I'm so I'm such an empath. However, like I just it's funny you ask this because I just had a leadership conversation with my my agent leadership team about reaching down for people and and how I believe that when you're at a point of leadership, you are obligated to reach down to lift people up, but only when they're reaching back.
Speaker 1:I don't ever think leaders are obligated to step down to pick people up, because once I've gotten to a point of like, if this is the leadership ladder and I'm at the top of it, I didn't. I didn't just wake up there, I had to climb every rung of the ladder. So it was work, it was hard. I went through everything. The people at the bottom are looking up saying how do I get there? I had to figure it out. I had to climb every rung.
Speaker 1:So now you're asking me to climb back down to get you. No, I'll lean over, I'll reach further than you'd ever think I'd reach, but if you won't even stick your arm up, now you're telling me you're a lost cause. However, just because your arm's not fully extended, it does not mean you're a lost cause, because a lot of times people don't realize their arm's not fully extended. They think they're doing everything they can. They just don't realize there's more they can give To those people. We as leaders are obligated, in my opinion, to continue to reach down not step down, but continue to reach down and teach them that there's points of growth Not necessarily change, but points of growth where if they learn, if they commit and they're willing to grow, then you can have micro moments of acceleration in their path and then bam, like their arm goes from this to this and wow, I can reach you now, Great, and I can pull you up.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I love that. Yeah, that's, that's a good, good way to put it. Instead of stepping down, you're kind of reaching down, because I kind of get sometimes frustrated when I've put time into, you know, helping somebody, a team whether it's a friend, team member, whatever and you spend your time on the phone telling them what they should be doing, what they should be eating, what they should be kind of leaning towards in their business, and then they completely just don't take your word, don't take anything that you're saying and don't actually put it into play, and that's just like to me that's just frustrating. So then I'm like, well, this person's a lost cause. We got to move on to the next one, see who the next one is.
Speaker 2:But I'm interested because you do more of that kind of speaking and motivational coaching and stuff than I do, and I just do it within our own kind of company and friends and whatever else. And it is. It's sometimes you see it, and you're like, well, this person's never going to lose the weight or they're never going to get that business off the ground because they're in their own way that's. You know something that I've seen our audio is recording right, okay, so I've done now two podcasts.
Speaker 2:Well, one podcast that we forgot to press audio recording okay and then another one last week where chase, I think, hit the mute button on that mic so we had lost half our audio on that one, so I was like I need to check every podcast before we get too far into this thing.
Speaker 2:Um, so now we're you. You were 17 year old. You built this marketing platform. You did it. You're now real estate guy. People know you around here for having your real estate team. What is kind of the difference between your team and other real estate teams? What kind of made you guys stand out?
Speaker 1:I think it's two sides. It's what people see and it's what people don't see. So from what people see, it's clearly marketing and branding. You know this is going to sound crazy. Eight years ago, when I became a realtor, the number one first conversation I had with my wife is I will never be a realtor. That was the sole rule. So prior to getting into real estate, I sold a business and retired. I was 35. I did not plan on working. I bought a 76 Ford F-150. I started. What is it called when you rip it apart and start building it back up? This is how good at it it was.
Speaker 2:Tinkering, I would call it.
Speaker 1:Restoring.
Speaker 2:Restoring okay, I started restoring it.
Speaker 1:So what I learned about me restoring vehicles is I am really great at ripping them apart. I didn't factor in the putting it back together part that I suck at. So what I ended up with was a torn apart 76 Ford F-150 in my driveway and a lot of free time. And one day true story my wife came to me and, like you see on TV, says, hey, you know, you're always home, like you should find something to do. And I'm thinking I did. It's called retirement. I found something to do. That wasn't jiving for her. So it was her idea to become realtors. So I said, okay, I'll do this, that's fine. But I got one caveat. I'm not going to be a realtor, I will be a business owner in real estate.
Speaker 1:We took a very different approach. Like that, realtors, I found, are transactional Business owners are long-term thinkers. Their growth mindset, they have a complete, they track everything They've got, just like you don't have to convince me to get up and go to work, it's just, it's built in me. It's who I am right, realtors. It's like yeah, you know, hey, you know, it's Phil. I'm sorry it's after six o'clock. You can, I'll get back to you in 24 hours. Like whose voicemail is that that's insane, right, that's a real estate agent perspective. That's a transactional agent.
Speaker 1:I knew I would never do that, so for me it was this idea that I'm never going to be that. So how do I differentiate myself? And it was do what you're great at already. I know marketing, I know branding. Let's create a brand, let's use the marketing we know and let's serve the masses.
Speaker 1:So I just looked for a space within real estate that I didn't have to teach people the real estate part, because that part I didn't know. I knew mortgage, but I didn't know how to be a realtor, right, so I didn't want to educate people on that part. I didn't know. I knew mortgage, but I didn't know how to be a realtor, right, so I didn't want to educate people on that part. So I went after expired listings and I literally just said I can show you why your home didn't sell, because I'm smart so I could tell quickly if you were overpriced. And I know marketing and branding so I could clearly tell if your home wasn't marketed properly.
Speaker 1:So I just pitched that the entire time I built, my entire first year in real estate sold 38 homes off of expired listings. That was my primary book. Second year 64 homes expired listings. I sold one home to someone I knew in my first year. That was the thing. Second year one home, someone I knew. Everything else came from putting in the hustle, putting in the work Eight to 10, every single morning and you were by yourself.
Speaker 2:You didn't have an agent on your team at that point.
Speaker 1:right Couldn't even have a team In Maryland. You can't have a team for three years.
Speaker 2:Three years. Yeah, yeah, yeah yeah.
Speaker 1:It was a solo agent. So for me it was like just figure out what you're good at already and find a way to turn that into something that will work. So that's what people knew us as I remember getting in the true story, I remember putting listings in the MLS in Coming Soon and an agent that had been an agent for like 20 something years. Why are you doing Coming Soon? Like what are you talking? You don't use Coming Soon to pre. You don't pre-market advertise your stuff. That's insane to me. Oh yeah, I see you on all this video. That's a fad, okay. So video's a fad. Okay, I'll see you, we'll see. You're going to come ask me how do you do this video stuff you know and and everybody. They would joke and they make fun, and then it became what people did.
Speaker 1:Now, internally, I have a whole different perspective. It's what people don't see. On my team, my number one philosophy is I want to teach every agent how to become so good that they truly do not need me, but I want to create a culture that is so beautiful that they never want to leave. And and in real estate in the United States, the average team has a turnover rate of one and a half years. Our turnover rate averages five years and that speaks to exactly what I wanted to grow from the very, very beginning. So I mean people aren't going to be with you forever.
Speaker 2:Most people, especially the good ones, typically end up going out to do something on their own, doing their own thing, brokering their own, and I'm proud of that.
Speaker 1:You know, if somebody's never done real estate before and then five, six, seven years later they go out on their own, they start their own team or they go solo, but whatever they do, they're highly successful. These team leads that bash them for it. What are you talking about? You poured into them for years and years and now everything you taught them they're proving to you that it worked. You should sing their praises. You should be incredibly proud of them. Never talk down about them.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's an interesting perspective and I feel like that's the kind of the mindset that people what do we say? This? It's like you either have the abundance mindset yeah or the opposite of that? What word am I looking for?
Speaker 1:I call it a spirit scarcity mindset.
Speaker 2:That's what I know so there's just like not enough. Like you think that there's not enough business around here? Like we talk, we joke um about, like the contracting world, like I'm a general contractor and some of my biggest competition are people that we have drinks and and whatever you know with all the time, and like between ryan and you know these other guys that are all in the same exact business after the same exact people and none of us are starving none of us are even like, yeah, we'll quote a job at this personal quote, whatever.
Speaker 2:But like, for the most part, we're out in our own world and we don't have to worry about any of those. We can collaborate with them, learn what they're doing, what's working for them, and they're willing to share their wins and losses and vice versa. And I feel like that's cool within real estate, because I don't think that that is in a lot of other industries, where people are more willing to collaborate with other businesses instead of push back, like, oh, don't give them our secrets. Like we're gonna, you know, so they're gonna take all of our secrets, they're gonna do better than us. Like that's not really how it works. Like it's not like we have this secret, uh, formula or invention that if we give them the, the cad drawings for that, they're gonna make all the money and we're not. Yeah, that's just not not how our industry goes I just dropped.
Speaker 1:Um, do you know who Phil Jones is? You wrote a book called exactly what to say. If you guys don't know it, you should definitely pick up this book. But I was with him in Hudson, new York, last two Fridays ago, 11 days ago and he challenged me to start this program where I literally give away every single thing I know about building a real estate business for a new agent. And he's like all right, you got 11 days to be fully launched, fully activated and launched. I'm like, all right, dude, you're crazy. But okay, I'll do it In 11 days.
Speaker 1:Website up everything done, the full plans built out. I launched it today. Today was day one. I said, all right, I got to monetize it because this is going to take a lot of effort for me, but I want everyone to be able to do it. So for 90 days, it's called your 90 day shift.
Speaker 1:I said, well, how can everyone do it? I'll charge you a dollar a day. So for 90 days, you pay $90 and I'm literally giving my entire blueprint away, a hundred percent of everything I did from day one to right now, and just go, it's yours. So you're talking about giving it all away. That's it. Because, number one why live in a scarcity mindset, like if I'm going to get the listing, I'm going to get the listing, no matter who I'm going up against, and if I'm not, I'm not, no matter who I'm going up against. So why not just share the love and give it away? And this way, when I'm across from the table from someone on a deal, we're both elevated to the highest level and we're not fighting. We're working together, because no one wins when we're all arguing.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we were talking about this today with LifeMed. Yep, you know LifeMed.
Speaker 3:I do.
Speaker 2:Dude, you know LifeMed right. They give away thousands of t-shirts.
Speaker 2:I have an appointment with them on tuesday to get some stuff checked for me. And it's we go to the gym every day and we see these people wearing those shirts and at first it was like, oh, what is this lm shirt? And then we go to a like the studio, a staging event, the golf tournament, they were sponsored there. Then you see people wearing the shirts there. Then it's that to me they're giving all that stuff away and they're like nice quality stuff and they're flooding their doors with people because they're just giving it all away.
Speaker 1:I have it. Yeah, literally I wear their stuff all the time, right, right, right, and they're great guys.
Speaker 2:We're talking about what Chase could give away for his group and all this stuff and we're like, give away something nice, give away something that really is a thing that people will talk, because when they're like, oh, that guy's like really selfless, he just gives away all this stuff and it's not like we're just like the branding is there but it's not like so flagrant that people aren't willing to wear it.
Speaker 2:It's very subtle, but it's not. You know, it's not like you got like the shirts that I make my guys wear in the field that says like general contracting property management like that's different. That's that's marketing this, like what we're talking about, like that life med shirt. It's just like it's just an lm. It could be just a brand of like a lululemon or whatever like you wouldn't even know.
Speaker 2:So yeah, I do agree with giving it away. That's why um nick and I do these events, and there's a lot of people that host these real estate events and they charge for tickets yeah and like I would much rather have some of the businesses that we have rent tape. You know, do the tables and stuff like that I we pay for the food through that we pay for the drink tickets, whatever we pay for the space.
Speaker 2:And now the people that really want to be there, to network, to to really learn what you know, to meet all the different people, whatever they get for free, the people that need it the most get it for free. So I think that's. I think that's, there's a lot of value.
Speaker 3:I think there goes a lot to say too with Phil, Like you were saying, giving the information away right, and I think it comes back twofold right, Because when you start giving away your information, your secrets, one of two things will happen. One someone will take it and they'll run with it and they'll implement it. Or the second one is they're going to come knocking at Phil's door saying, hey, Phil, I need help implementing this and now Phil can say, all right, now $1,500, $10,000, whatever he needs to charge.
Speaker 3:So that's something I've seen a lot in coaching and stuff. Phil, I did have a question for you. What do you think people do wrong?
Speaker 1:easy answer they try and become a leader. Yeah, that's my easy. It's funny you mentioned this man because I'm like I've got two guys right now and we've got this whole shift in our business that happens starting the 1st of January and we're really in the hyper growth mode of of of rolling that out right now. Uh, and it's all about leadership and it's leaders are always followers first, and no leader ever says, hey, I'm a leader, you just don't have to say it. Other people say it for you, so they just try and become leaders.
Speaker 1:So if I sit here and I'm like, okay, I'm going to be a leader, then I start going around trying to figure out what do I need to do to be a leader. But if I sit here and say, well, I'm going to be a servant, well, then I got to get to know you, I got to get to know you, I got to get to know you, and then I've really got to figure out again, going back to that value diamond, what's important to you, what is your, what do you value the most? And then all I really have to do is figure out how I can serve the facet of the diamond that you value the most, and then we build trust and then the more you trust me and the more I step out and I continue to serve you. You realize that every single leader there is that you really, really call a leader is actually just a servant disguised in a really nice suit. That's it, that's a good answer.
Speaker 2:So to play off that a little little bit, when you're not trying to be a leader, but sometimes like, for example, I was a public school teacher, I started this company, it was supposed to be just me and my buddy buying a couple rental properties.
Speaker 2:Now it's evolved into this thing. So eventually you just become a leader. Right, and it just happened, naturally. What are the mistakes then that people make when they're thrown into that situation? When, like, I never thought that I would have a staff of 40 people working for me and people in the office, people in the field, people all over the place, whatever. I never thought that I was going to be in that position. So what are when you do get into that position? What do you think the most common mistakes are that position? So what are when you do get into that?
Speaker 1:position. What do you think the most common mistakes are? Yeah, I think. First, I want to say you literally just proved my point. You started with saying I was a public school teacher. So what I just heard is I was a servant. Like you've literally just said, I was a servant and then I started this thing. It wasn't supposed to be this. But look what happens. Like you didn't say I'm going to go be a leader, you just said, well, I'm a servant and I'm just going to use the skills that I also have and then start investing. And then, look, you see, leaders can't help but find their way into leadership. That's why you are where you are. You're meant to be this amazing person and you're going to find your way into that. But it starts with service first, because the core values of leadership start with service, and I'm sure that some of the heartfelt passion that you used as being a public school teacher you probably instill in some of the conversations you have with your employees.
Speaker 2:A hundred percent. Yeah, there you go. This is another thing we were talking about the other day. Have you guys ever heard of the sandwich technique? When you're talking to people or like breaking bad news to somebody?
Speaker 4:No.
Speaker 2:So I was talking to Chase the other day and I was like I thought this was bogus by the way I was like, were you?
Speaker 2:downstairs watching a youtube video and he's like we, we were presenting the sellers, uh, with an offer and I was like we got to get this thing sold. Like this is what we got to do the sandwich technique. And he's like what the hell is the sandwich technique? And I'm like they taught, they taught us this in public, like to go to be a public school teacher.
Speaker 2:Like when you're talking to parents, you say something good, then you give them the bad and then you give them a good at the end, before they can even think about the bad, you're saying another good thing and you're stuffing that good thing down your throat. So you got the bad in there. But immediately is followed by a nice little compliment or something nice. And it really does talk about human psychology. Like when you're even reading something. When I read some an email to me, when I know they're doing it to me, I know I'm like, oh, this does feel better, even though I know what they're doing. Like it does feel better when you're like, oh, that is a nice compliment actually a nice little compliment at the end.
Speaker 1:I mean, I see that, but this is really nice.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's something that really does work and, like, I think, communicating um is one of, like, the number one things that you can do in business just in general, whether it's in sales, whether it's in like you're in a position with you're the boss, and then there's an employee situation. Whatever, you have to be able to communicate and, and I think, knowing those different strategies on how to make people feel good when even it might be a bad thing. Exactly you know, I think there's. There's definitely something to be said about that.
Speaker 1:I think that it's uh to your question. I think it's important that people don't get ready to get ready. I think a lot of people that start businesses spend a lot of time getting ready to get ready, meaning they don't do the important money-making time activities. Instead, they just make sure they have business cards and they make sure their papers are in order and everything else. While you're doing that, I'm selling your sister a house. Your business cards are beautiful but they're like 30 days too late. You know, your neighbor already sold with me and it's just, we get lost. People tend to get lost in the pretty of things and they don't realize that hustle is what wins games.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think Nick does this even more than I do, but I think Nick's even better than it and I do this too. But like I'm like it, just do it and we'll figure it out. Like just pull the trigger and then we'll figure it out and and there was another thing, go back to teaching it was like they, they had this like saying and it was like ready fire aim there it is, I know it and yeah and that's what you?
Speaker 2:yeah, nick bought a million dollar house that he's living in right now and didn't know that he was approved for the loan.
Speaker 4:Like crazy. Yeah, he did it. That was a little scary, putting down almost a hundred thousand dollar deposit and not knowing cause it was an auction property. I had to put 10% down, yeah.
Speaker 2:So, like sometimes you got a ready fire aim and it works out, and then other times it doesn't work out and you got to be ready. Because that's my adult. I'm flipping a house right now and I'm about to lose $50,000 plus on and I told Chase I was like I'm buying this deal. I stuffed it down his throat, I bought it and it's a loser, and so you got to be able to live with those losses too.
Speaker 2:I do like talking about the losses a lot because I feel like it's so easy to talk about all the wins and people think that you're just this constant, constant winner.
Speaker 2:And I was talking to a contractor today, a buddy of mine who runs a local company, and just got taken for like 180 something thousand dollars by a scam artist of a client and basically like thought there was this huge profit margin on the job and and now diana is suing the guy for like multiple six figures and that, um yeah, that that stuff hurts. You know this guy's been in business for as long as I've been alive um 30, you know, 30 years. Business does everything the right way and is taking the losses. So there are losses to be had as well. So that brings me to my next question Phil, what are some of your biggest losses in the real estate business? Because there are a lot of people that will say that they've never lost money on a deal or they've never put money into marketing that didn't work out. And I'm not saying when did you lose a million dollars or anything like that, but what's some of the losses that you've had to kind of deal with?
Speaker 1:I mean I've lost on investment deals, things like that, like a lot of people have, similar to what you just mentioned. I think that for me remember I said I'm a massive empath, so for me, the losses come when it's so hard for me to see someone and I'm like I know you can do it and they quit on themselves. For me, actually, it shuts me down, like a lot of people say. Well, just like power through it. I don't, which is crazy, because I'm like I'm the guy on the stage telling you exactly how to get through it. The way I get through it is I literally check out so like I'll have some, some, a big player that I know is like you could be a superstar, and then they just go a totally different direction.
Speaker 1:I'm taking the. I'm taking 24 hours to myself. I'm going out on the boat. I'm not taking my wife, I'm not taking my kids, like you're not going to see me for 24. I'm sleeping on the boat. You're not gonna see me for 24 hours. I'm just going to be with me and I'm just going to find myself again. I'm just going to reconnect with who I am and then I'm going to power through.
Speaker 1:So for me, the law. I'm just not money motivated. I've never been a money motivated person. I used to be poor. So it's a crazy concept because, even poor, I was never money motivated. But not being money motivated, while people say, well, it's easy for you to say now, it was easy for me to say then too, what I am motivated by is the ability to serve, and because of that, when I'm serving and then I see there's an opportunity for someone to grow and really like man, you're right there. What do you? How could you possibly quit right now? It crushes me, like truly shuts me down. So those are the losses for me. Like I just I'm the polar opposite of my wife though.
Speaker 4:Like she is like if there's a financial loss, you'll know it, like that's why she's our cfo at what point, as you mentioned earlier, reaching your arm down for those people and the people that that quit and give up, at what point do you stop? At what point do you know that that's kind of like the end to them and you just stop reaching your hand down to pull them up?
Speaker 1:ask questions. When you ask enough, you'll get to the answers and they will. They'll tell you. But I give up on not a single soul that hasn't told me to give up on them. But I also listen. As soon as you tell me to Like you're not going to fool me because you're going to tell me this isn't a trick, this isn't a what? If this isn't, I'll kind of give you an answer. Like somebody left my team a week and a half ago and in conversation they're like well, do I have to give you an answer? Now I say, yep, you sure do. Like you're.
Speaker 1:You're not holding me hostage for two days while you think about it. Go interview with other teams and everything else. I'm here now. I love you, I support you, I've been supporting you this period of time, but this isn't an opportunity for you to use me. This is an opportunity. This, right now, is your opportunity to see my dedication to you. And now I'm curious if you're also dedicated to you, because you don't have to be dedicated to me. I'm dedicated to me, god's dedicated to me, my wife is dedicated to me, I'm good. So now this is an opportunity for you to be dedicated to you. So if you're telling me this is not the space that you can be dedicated to. You. Tell me right now, because you already know. You don't need two days to think about it. That's BS. It's tell me the truth. So yeah, I need the answer now.
Speaker 1:So, as soon as they tell me it's like a lead, when do you stop calling a lead? You stop calling a lead when they tell you don't call me again. A lot of times people say, well, you stop calling the lead when they die. No, you don't. You call the owner of their estate when that person dies. You keep calling the lead until the lead tells you to stop calling. I keep reaching down until someone says I quit. Outside of that, I'm going to keep reaching. It's exhausting, guys. I'm going to tell you right now. I could right now change my entire philosophy and make a ton more money. I know I could. I just wouldn't look at myself in the mirror Like I'm not that person. I also would say I'm not right. I'm just right for me. This is just how I've always lived. Other people do it other ways. They are also right for them. There is no judgment. It's just this is Phil's way for Phil, not for the next guy.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think that's really like a strong thing, cause actually we've been talking about, like I'm involved in all these different businesses, right, and it it does get like just mentally exhausting trying to switch all these hats and this stuff and that stuff between this business and that business, and I'm like you know how much. And when it comes to money, chase and I were fishing the other day on the Severn where I was just like how much is enough? Because if, if it's the difference between making 50 K a month and 75 K a month, is that going to? Is that going to break your like? Is that really going to be the thing that hurts you, like I think.
Speaker 2:So I don't think that that extra 25k a month is going to really move the bar. And we were talking like when you get to a certain point, right then it's like jet money and you know you're making a million a month or whatever. Okay, sure, that's totally different level if that's what you. But if you're making, you know, 40, 50k a month or and you're happy, or you could start that one more business and take a little bit more of your family time and a little bit more of your leisure time and just to make an extra 20.
Speaker 1:It's not worth.
Speaker 2:It's not worth it to me, it's not worth it and and I think um, sean magner says this a lot to me um, there's riches and niches and just like doing the things that make that bring you happiness. Because there are like businesses like my construction business I love it. Like it is a great, sometimes stressful, but it's a great business. Like it's profitable. We always see this product at the end. That's like nice and we get to be proud of that. And then, like my property management business, it's a shitty business.
Speaker 2:Like that's I always talk about it on the podcast. I got chase to not start his own property management company, not because I didn't want the competition, because I saved his life like seriously he was like he was riding around with me for a while and he was like talking about starting private management. Like, dude, don't do it, just hang out with me for a little while. Just hang out and see for yourself and he hung out enough to know, like every day, another fucking property management problem, another time.
Speaker 3:I didn't want, I didn't want that headache at all.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know, I realized quick and I'm just like you know what. Maybe I just focus on on one thing and just like get rid of all the other stuff, scale down. Everybody talks about scaling up, but when the importance of you knowing when to scale down is like I think that's even greater than when you have the ability to scale up.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I agree.
Speaker 2:So that's that's something that I've been personally working on recently is just like where do we, how much do we need? Right and cause you can like you have a hundred rental properties. How many do you need? How many do you want? Do you want a thousand, do you want 2000? Does it ever stop? Like, is there a goal? Because that's another problem that I have we keep moving the goalposts. I think we were talking about this on a recent podcast too. It's like the goalpost keeps getting moved every time you hit that thing that you thought you never had or would have, and that's a hard. So I guess the question for you is like do you have a goalpost?
Speaker 1:I. The question for you is do you have a goalpost? I have macro goals, I have micro goals. I have an end. My end is about five years from now.
Speaker 2:But it's a time limit. It's not a financial limit, it's not a I need to have this much of something, not even money. Money, just like this many houses, this many people on the team it's just the time like this is how many more years I'm giving to the community, to whatever, to this business.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I I met my wife when I was 14.
Speaker 1:She was 13 we've been roll dogs our entire lives, right? So we started dating um officially at like all. We dated on and off our whole life and then in at like 19 I think she was 19, I was 20 or something. We we have been together since then. So the catch has been she has done everything.
Speaker 1:I'm an entrepreneur you know what it's like, right, like? Your lady pretty much follows you and they support you. If you've got a good one, they just support your crazy ideas over and over and over again. I want to start this. Okay, go for it, honey, I got it Right. That's my wife Incredibly supportive. So I told her when I turned 50, I'll do two things. 50, I'll do two things I'm going to move into politics or we can just travel, but you can pick. Now recently I realized I don't need to wait till I'm 50. I just need to wait till my kids leave for college. Well, for me that's 48. My daughter would have left, and so it's about five years. So when my daughter leaves for college, my wife has already decided she has no interest in me being in politics.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I was going to talk you out of that one real quick.
Speaker 1:So it's travel. So if it's travel, then my thought is, well, what do I love to do? I really, really love speaking and coaching. So I got with some mentors of mine and I developed a concept that I've been I've actually been talking about the profitable persuasion method and that is going to consistently develop over the course of the next five years into an elite inner circle. And that elite inner circle will consist of four events a year in places like Fiji or somewhere like that, right, Like super beautiful places. But just four events a year, one per quarter, three days each. We cover absolutely everything.
Speaker 1:So you fly out. Once you get there, you were just taken care of and it's the highest level leadership event you've ever been to, every quarter. That's how you should feel when you leave and that should top line revenue. Me one and a half million a year for four events a year. I do nothing else all year. Now the catch is I don't intend on planning any of it About a month before. I'll just build out my talk tracks, like my part, right, but I'll have a staff and everything that'll run absolutely all of it, That'll prep everything and everything else. I don't want to do all the backend work. I don't want the headache, I don't want another job, right? I want to travel with my wife Now, on and off between there, people are going to do like they do now.
Speaker 1:They call me hey, can you fly out here and can you speak at this event or that event? So guess what I'll do? Not a problem, my wife's coming right. I need my media manager to be there too. So you, now you need to fly me, you need to find my wife and you need to find my media manager out. My media manager will fly home after my wife will stay there with me for about two, three weeks. So we'll just explore where we are and that's it we're. Also. We have a 34 foot vessel. Now we're going to be in next year. We're going to sell that and we're going to buy a 50 foot. We're going to be living on our, on our, on our yacht. We're not going to be living in a house. We're going to buy two cottages or or condos wherever our kids go to school, and that'll be our home bases where they are, and that's the life we want.
Speaker 2:You tell them they have to go to school somewhere coastal so you can take the boat. They know the rules. They know the rules.
Speaker 1:Absolutely. Right now they're both leaning in Florida two different parts of Florida. So I am golden. I'm loving this yeah.
Speaker 2:That's great. Yeah, that's a good life. So traveling speaking, that's basically the long-term Phil Gerd's goal.
Speaker 1:And then the team will still be there. I just don't want to run it every day. You know the real estate side of things. It'll be there, but I'll sit on the board. I don't want to be in every day answering questions, solving problems. That's where me, today, developing leaders become so darn important, because if, five years from now, I'm still doing the things I'm doing today, it is no one's fault, but my own. It's a lack of leadership, it's an ego issue, Because leaders should transfer skills, not aim to just create and then keep.
Speaker 1:That's not leadership, it's almost like that.
Speaker 4:What would the transition look like when you step out of your real estate business and have somebody replace yourself? Have you already done that, or is that something that you would still have to do? And what would that look like if you haven't done it already?
Speaker 1:It's, it's. We're in the absolute infancy of that happening and the transition will look invisible. That's the beautiful thing about it. So here's, here's your secret. You hear the Gerdes team when you start hearing TGT and you stop hearing the Gerdes team. Know that Phil is about to leave, Like he's. He's almost gone. He's almost gone Cause, while Gerdes is my last name. It is simply a brand, that's all it is. It might. It could have been road. It could have been Smith. It could have been Google, it could have been anything. Could have been green, it could have been Smith. It could have been Google. It could have been anything. It could have been green. It could have been absolutely anything. It's just a brand, that's it. So the transition should be invisible. If you see the transition, I have done it wrong. I'd appreciate if you three say Phil, don't leave. Yet You've messed this up. You need another year.
Speaker 4:So how does it? What does it look like internally then? So how does it? What does?
Speaker 1:it look like internally then, my marketing director, my operations director, my media manager, my two agent leaders, possibly my TC, all having ownership, I would still carry the primary bulk of ownership. I would still carry the primary bulk of ownership, like I will always have the ability to finalize all decisions. The reason for that is because the day my kids come back and say, hey, dad, we want this, I want them to be able to have it right or have controlling interest in it. However, I don't want to control it, that's the thing. So they'll all have ownership and they will run it like a true business that it is. But again, I want nothing to do with it. I just want to sit on the board, Call me in for the big things, and that's it. And call me in through Google Meet because I'm not coming back, that's it.
Speaker 2:So to get a little bit granular, because we do have a lot of people that listen, that are aspiring real estate investors, real estate agents. What have you so just a little bit about, like the current state of the market, where we're at.
Speaker 2:We see rates coming down a little bit and some houses seem like they're still sitting on the market even with the rates coming down a little bit, and some houses seem like they're still sitting on the market even with the rates coming down. What do you see coming in the future? The next couple of months, we have an election coming up, just a little kind of overview.
Speaker 1:I think everybody has their own opinion. No one has a glass ball, but if you look at the historical data, there's not been an election in the United States where the post-election year hasn't seen an uptrend in real estate. So we were just talking about this internally. Homes are going to sell next year, with or without us. No one here is changing that. If historical data speaks true, homes are going to sell, they're going to move and sellers are going to do really well in 2025.
Speaker 1:What should buyers do? Don't wait for 2025. And I think when buyers hear real estate agents say this, they're like oh, they just want to sell us homes. No, we're trying to protect you. The rates are supposed to continue to trend downward. Why would you wait? This is just pragmatism. Why would you wait for competition? You will end up spending more money. It literally makes no mathematical sense to me. I do not understand when anyone says, yes, I could buy now, but I'd rather wait until next year. I could buy now, but I'd rather wait for you to compete against me, because, guess what, I'm going to compete against you going back to psychology, I think, because the hype isn't there, similar to crypto.
Speaker 4:When crypto was going through the roof and everybody was talking about it, they wanted to buy it and when it came down, everyone stopped talking about it and a lot of people stopped buying it.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, but so, okay, let's break that down a little bit. One of the big things and I think in different parts of the market we talk about, like you know, we got the higher end people we have the lower let's just call it the 200K buyers and the million dollar buyers.
Speaker 2:right, where those 200K buyers are very, very reliant on their monthly payment, right, that's the make or break. They, in a lot of senses, don't even look at the final number, because where the million dollar buyer always looks at that final number down to the $5,000 or the $3,000. We know that the 200K buyer is looking at. What do they have to pay per month, right? So do you see the rates affecting those different markets differently?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think the problem there is actually not the buyer, it's the real estate agent. Again, it goes back to the transactional approach versus the educational approach. So you're talking to that 200K buyer. Let's use different numbers. Let's say I have the buyer with a $400,000 budget. Okay, well, I can't afford right now to buy the house I want because it's $450,000. Okay, so why don't I just educate you on the benefits of buying a $350,000 house right now the potential for increase over the next year and a half in equity and the ability to sell that.
Speaker 1:Get a quick turn. Maybe you get a higher net of $25,000, flip that $25,000 into another house. You're going to have lower interest rates so you have a more down payment. You can buy more house because you have a lower payment and you're in a better position and you got a better house. Now you're not going to go buy a $450,000 house. You're going to buy a $375,000 house, but it's going to be more house because money costs less at that point in time. The problem is most realtors don't even understand the concept of it because they're out here being transactional instead of educational and they can't be educational for their clients because they don't take enough time educating themselves. They're not talking to guys like you. I mean, that's the fact of it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think that's another thing. I was talking to somebody the other day who came to me for an estimate. So I do like $300 consultations where I'll go out to a house and I'll estimate the construction for investors, especially new investors that don't know the whole process and stuff, and I feel like that's part of the problem. They have these realtors that are selling these investors' houses and then I simply ask them. I say, well, can you ask your realtor how many investment properties that they have purchased, owned, renovated? And if the answer is no, maybe they're a great agent and they've sold, retailed whatever. Fire them and if it's not me, hire somebody else that actually has experience in this space, because if you're, it's like getting a heart surgeon that's never actually worked on a human heart.
Speaker 2:They've only worked on like animals yeah, like that's not the person I want helping me with my heart problems.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I want somebody that's done this a hundred times and we see it all the time with these agents that just have they know nothing and they're like oh, we're talking to these people, I'm selling one and we're chasing I have one in the neighborhood and they're like the one people that were like, oh, this is going to cost three hundred fifty thousand dollars to fix the. And I'm like I already have an estimate. It's a hundred thousand dollars. I've written out line by line, like you're, you're telling your buyers 250 000. Like you're making up this arbitrary number. Yeah, you have no idea.
Speaker 2:You have no literally no experience, no idea and you're just saying this number, killing the deal completely, because that in their head now they're like, oh, if he said 350, even though this other guy who's a licensed contractor says it's going to be 100, my agent's telling me 350. So even if they think in their head, well, it's somewhere between 100 and 350, that just they're going with the agent what they should be doing, they being the agent.
Speaker 1:The agent should be edifying someone like you, lifting you up, lifting your expertise up and letting you do your job and trusting you to do your job. And now the buyer is now on your side, but the buyer is also on the agent side, because the agent says anything I need. I'm sorry. The buyer says anything I need. I can go to my agent and they will always bring me a trustworthy affiliate. They'll always bring me someone that I can count on. So I trust my agent even more now. Yeah, you know.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, I'm with you yeah, there's a lot of that um yeah a lot of that nonsense and that was my segue into my next question. So the the whole nar settlement thing right we're a couple months into it. Don't think I was gonna get you on this question, you know.
Speaker 1:On this topic.
Speaker 2:So I think what Chase and I have talked about other people we feel like it is well, it should be weaning out a lot of bad or non-performing agents, right? What other things have you seen from this as changes? Because for us it's just the only thing that changes. People asking, hey, what's the commission? That's literally right. Hey, what's the commission? That's literally right. I mean, what else have you seen?
Speaker 3:It's just agents calling you now, asking you what your compensation is from the solution I mean that's in the state of Maryland.
Speaker 1:That is legally the only change, right, we can't put it on the MLS. We have different docs, that's it Right. That's it right, the. The change that is not like a more legal change is that agents actually have to verbalize their job, as opposed to say, just sign this in docusign, because I tell sellers all the time that I'm at, obviously like we're asked this question by sellers, right? So what's the difference? Nothing. Well, why do I keep hearing about it? Well, because you see this section here.
Speaker 1:Typically agents just brief, buy it and they don't explain it. So you've never known that. You never had to pay this, ever, because agents have never explained it. And a lot of agents simply don't even know how to explain it. So again, the problem is the realtor. It is not. It wasn't NAR, it wasn't this, it wasn't that. No, that's not true. It kind of was NAR, because NAR knew the problem was the realtor and they did absolutely nothing about it until it was too late. And now it's like backpedaling. How do we fix? How do we fix? How do we fix? Educate demand a certain level of education, as opposed to 60 hours to get someone to be qualified, which is crazy to help me sell the largest asset I will arguably ever have in my entire life.
Speaker 2:Do you think, though, it's causing and I saw it today for the first time causing some agents to now have to go against their fiduciary duties Because, for example, have to go against their fiduciary duties because, for example, I had an agent hit me up on a rental listing that I have for my property management company, and it's a big, it's a $4,000 a month house in this neighborhood, so it's a nice it's a good rental yeah.
Speaker 2:Nice neighborhood and I told them that the buyers or tenant compensation side would be 25%. At the end of the day I'm going to net basically 60, 70%. I'm giving away 25%. That's what it is. Yeah, and he canceled the showing. Yep, and I'm like so, even if that house was the best house for your clients.
Speaker 1:Yep.
Speaker 2:Because the compensation was, let's say, $1,000 instead of $2,000 or whatever. Whatever it is, you canceled the three to five years.
Speaker 1:That's my answer three to five years for the next set of lawsuits. For everyone that realizes wait a minute, I didn't. I didn't miss that house because I did something wrong. I missed the house because my realtor realized they weren't getting paid what they wanted.
Speaker 2:Yeah, three to five years, and we had the same shit on that house that I'm losing in Adelphi, in College Park, and the agent's like we gave her 2% and she's just like well, she's literally negotiating for 2.5% on her behalf yeah, not on her client's behalf, instead of on the client's behalf and I'm like does this lady not want to make a deal at all, or does she want to fuck her clients to make an extra three thousand?
Speaker 3:dollars.
Speaker 2:It's insane dollars so I feel like that's a problem that this whole thing created that I don't think people are talking about. Is that that it's making these agents claw? These bottom feeder agents claw away and it's going to make people go against their fiduciary duties to the clients.
Speaker 1:I could not agree more. I could not agree more. I remember I had a client a while ago, buyers and sellers. It was a couple. They were both selling their home. We sold their home and they were looking for their forever home.
Speaker 1:We went into an auction home, toured the auction home toward the auction home. When it was done, we were out front. They're like we want to put an offer on this house. And they say to me hey, we never asked you, are you even getting paid on this? Because it's an auction? And I'm like guys, I'm gonna be honest with you, I don't know. I never look to see if I'm getting paid on a home. That's not what I'm here for and, truthfully, I never again.
Speaker 1:Just my way, not the right way, just the way I do things. So I was like I don't have any idea. Well, they're like well, can you look? Like, why does it matter? Well, we just want to know. So I pull it up right in front of them, like, honestly, guys, no, I'm not getting paid on this. They're like oh, my goodness, we're so sorry. What can we do? I'm like nothing, nothing, I didn't sign something saying, well, if I'm paid, then I'd work with you. And then they actually said, yeah, but didn't we sign something? That said, because I signed a buyer agency agreement that we would pay you. I was like, yeah, but no, that's cool, that's not how I do business. Now I know that some people think that's absolutely absurd and in this market now with the changes, yeah, it's different. Okay, cause now there's a prep and buyers really are starting to understand that you're gonna cover some costs. But, dude, like to cancel a listing.
Speaker 2:Yeah, cancel a showing.
Speaker 1:Or a showing rather yeah, that's crazy.
Speaker 3:Yeah. So I don't know if you've. If you're, you and your team have experiences, but you know when, when the agents do call, the buyer's agents do call and they're asking about compensation and things of that nature, and you tell them, well, maybe the seller was willing to go up to 2%. And they say, well, that's absolutely ridiculous. What are you telling your team to kind of respond to that nature of an agent? Because I feel like on my side of things, it's the buyer's agent's responsibility to negotiate with their client and show their value to their client.
Speaker 2:And can we paint the demographic? It's 50-plus women realtors, 50-year-olds and older women realtors that have been in the business.
Speaker 3:You're going to be canceled after this podcast.
Speaker 1:So what I want to do is I want to make clear that I didn't say that because I'm not going to be canceled after this podcast. That's so what I want to do is I want to make clear that I didn't say that because I'm not gonna be canceled.
Speaker 2:I didn't say anything about the age or the sex of any real whatsoever, but you heard it.
Speaker 1:But you heard, I didn't hear a thing in fact you'll be breaking up um the talk track to that. Uh, I mean we could role play it if you want and see where it goes.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so let's just say I call Phil Phil. What is your seller's offering to compensate me as the buyer?
Speaker 1:Or the buyer's agent. Buyer compensation on this deal is 2%.
Speaker 3:That's ridiculous.
Speaker 1:Really.
Speaker 3:Phil.
Speaker 1:Ridiculous.
Speaker 3:Yeah, they're only willing to do 2%. The seller's decided to do 2%. Yeah, that's ridiculous, really, phil, ridiculous yeah they're only willing to do 2%.
Speaker 1:The sellers decided to do 2%. Yeah, that's it.
Speaker 2:It's like a low ball.
Speaker 3:That's crazy to me. I work really hard, Phil.
Speaker 1:Crazy to you.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I work really hard for my money sir, you're not gonna win this yeah, and I I realized that you realize yeah so that's the key, right.
Speaker 1:So I have two options. I can play your game, right, which, in the end, where's the seller in our phone call? Not to be found, not to be found why would I play a game with you, right? I have an agreement between me and my seller. Nothing you say has anything to do with that agreement. So all I'm doing by going back and forth with you is wasting my time when I could be out selling your sister a house. Yeah, just go find the next deal.
Speaker 1:So what I'm doing here is I'm just using tactics from Chris Foss's Never Split the Difference Right and I'm just mirroring you. I'm just using tactics from Chris Voss's Never Split the Difference right and I'm just mirroring you. I'm just saying the last three words that you said. I'm just repeating and going back and I'm making you talk. Right, because the person in control is the one that's asking questions. The person that thinks they're in control is the one that is talking. So all I keep doing is making you talk and when we're done, you will give up feeling like you won because you got to talk the most, and I will just be finished on the phone.
Speaker 2:I do feel like, though, that when you have that conversation, sometimes it then creates this like us against them mentality, so this can't be us against them, and then, but that and that's my point it's because we are here serving somebody else. In this whole transaction. It's like the two realtors are talking to each other only because they're on behalf of somebody else, and I feel like a lot of agents are, especially now when they can't see that compensation when they look on the MLS listing. A lot of agents are having trouble with understanding their value or understanding that this is an agreement between the seller and the selling agent and that's a broker issue.
Speaker 1:So it's scaling. Whose fault? This is right. So I become a real estate agent. My expectation is that I know how to do real estate.
Speaker 1:Unfortunately, becoming a real estate agent, the process of becoming a real estate agent at no point in time is to teach you how to become a real estate agent. It is to teach you how to pass a real estate exam. There is no point in becoming an agent that is to teach you how to become a real estate agent or how to act as an agent. It is just to teach you how to become a real estate agent or how to how to act as an agent. It is just to teach you how to pass an exam. The job of a broker is to teach you how to become a well-qualified agent. So when you're saying that you know, they don't know, it's. That's the broker's fault. So we just OK. We know Nara's problem. They saw the issue and let it happen. We know the broker's problem. Now they are not doing their job, which is providing leadership and support for solo agents.
Speaker 1:And then whose fault's next? Well, it's the team leader's fault. Is the team leader providing enough for their team to educate them? And a lot of team leaders, they don't have meetings. We have meetings every single week, every Monday, a two-hour training every single Monday. They are mandatory meetings. Now someone's going to say, well, you're not allowed to have mandatory meetings in real estate. Well, let's be very clear. You don't have to come, you just can't be on my team. That's it, right? It's real simple. And then the next side is well, it's the agent's fault. Well, why is it the agent's fault? Because we have really unique tools like google and youtube, where you can go find any answer to anything in any training you ever wanted, and people don't take it. You know his fault. It's not the seller or the buyer right, and that's that's.
Speaker 2:They're the people that I feel like are getting the most screwed out of this situation is because now the agents are fighting for their way and trying to make that extra 0.5% or 0.25% or whatever it is on a transaction, when the only people that are getting screwed are the people, the innocent people on the side that are just trying to buy or sell a home.
Speaker 3:Be what it is. You should say, okay, I'm going to go get the 0.5 from my buyer. Yeah, and that should be it.
Speaker 1:Or you're going to write your contract 0.5 over what you would do and you're gonna say well, this is now being added in right, like there's ways around it. But because the buyer agents aren't educated on how to do it, then they're not doing it. And and because they're adding emotion into things, they're they're being emotional like it's just, it's unnecessary right you know, and then you get hit with the magic.
Speaker 1:Well, I've been doing this for 26 years. Yes, I don't care. What's that got to do with things? We all been doing this for seven months, okay this is brand new.
Speaker 2:In the last 27 years did you have a cell phone 27?
Speaker 1:exactly no, you picked up a big book and that's how you saw the listings that got updated every week like give me a break that?
Speaker 2:yeah, that to me is just absurd when they say I've been doing well. Things change things yeah congratulations actually do change um damn. I had one more, like one more hitter on this thing, but now I'm forgetting.
Speaker 4:I forget it well, I I think the positive of that is just getting that phone call like that starts the conversation and negotiating and shows interest to where you can follow back up with that agent to see if their client's still interested at that point.
Speaker 2:Yeah, oh, I agree, I got it, so I just had this my last. This is my last question. So I had um a client in town a couple weeks ago from new zealand. In new zealand they have a one broker for the transaction.
Speaker 2:Yeah, do you see us going towards that model where there will be like we have listings and then we can have one of our people show the house? We don't need another agent? Do you think, like, because we have zillow, we have all these tools for buyers to go find the houses, like you don't need a buyer's agent anymore? Really, let's be honest, if you're an educated, non-licensed person, you can go buy a house without a buyer's agent. You can go directly to whatever listing agent, negotiate on your own behalf, hire a lawyer to look at the contract for you for 500 bucks and you can be protected on your end by your attorney, and the broker is the broker, like a card broker or any other broker that we have that has one person that finds, has the seller and the buyer and puts them together has the seller and the buyer and puts them together.
Speaker 1:So, um, I didn't say that, oh, I don't know, I don't think we're ever getting there. No, honestly, I don't. I think that we are. We're just as a country. I think we're just very different and I think we're too independent. I think we are individually independent enough to say I want my own thing, I want my own person. And I think that people are naturally too flaky to trust themselves to such a massive quest to say I'm going, gonna buy this on my own, because it's not like you can trade in your car.
Speaker 2:You don't trade in your house, you know yeah, the way I look at it, though, there are people, highly successful people that you know, start businesses, they buy and they sell heavy pieces of machinery, they do whatever. So they there are people that are confident, confident enough, and some people we talk to that are like oh, I'm going to list the house on my own, I'm going to list do it for sale by owner, whatever.
Speaker 2:So there are people that will do that. So you're thinking that the only reason that that model wouldn't take off is because there's enough people that wouldn't be willing?
Speaker 1:to go. I think there's more than enough.
Speaker 2:I think there's more than enough. Yeah, I think there's more than enough. Yeah, I mean, you mentioned for sale by owners. If you got to the point, if this whole situation got to the point where, instead of them saying, hey, what's my compensation? Now the that agent has to go to the buyer and say, hey, in order for me to show you this house or for you to get this house, you have to come out of pocket and pay me 10 grand.
Speaker 4:Well, that'll be on the buyer's representation agreement, and you have to get that signed before showing your house.
Speaker 2:Nowadays anyway, Right, well, that's what I'm saying. So you present it to this. Now you're my buyer and I present this and I'm saying, hey, you got 10 grand, because that's what it's going to cost.
Speaker 1:You're saying, if it gets to the point where sellers literally, literally do not pay buyer side compensation, do I think we go that route? I don't think we go that right. I think that buyer side compensation drops dramatically. I think listing side compensation actually increases. Listing agents' jobs become a lot harder. They end up getting a lot more work that they have to do and the buyer side turns into a flat fee. I think we work on a flat fee buyer side. I don't think it's 10 grand, I think it's going to be in the thousands. I think you're going to have an admin fee with a flat side in the thousands and it's more of a security play for a buyer's agent. But you know, think of it this way right, like the story you just depicted. Works right, hire a lawyer and everything else, but how do they get in the house?
Speaker 2:Well, that's where you know you have to show the house. So we have a, let's say we have a girl at our office that is our showing agent. She gets paid $20 an hour. When she's not showing houses, she's doing TC work. The listing agent has that. Yes, okay, yeah, so that that like right now we have a listing 900 K listing the owner is requiring one of us to be at the house.
Speaker 1:We'll be showing. Have that happen all the time.
Speaker 2:Right, especially with your same thing, yeah, so similar concept.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, I just don't.
Speaker 2:I that's like in an ideal world, because then we can make charge three and a half percent, 4%, and it's still less than what they would come out of pocket for if it was two and a half, two and a half or three and three, whatever. And for us or other teams, other bro, any broker can have that hourly employee that's out there just every day showing houses, yeah, opening doors so I didn't mention um commission percentages.
Speaker 1:I won't put that on here. So I just never see us going that way. I just think as a country we aren't the type that would submit to just forfeiting that level of security. I don't know who's right, yeah no, no, we'll find out right.
Speaker 2:This is more of a brainstorm thing. I'm just like in my head. I'm thinking, because there are places in the world that there is one broker, much of Europe is this way.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, yeah Much of Europe is exactly how you're saying. I just don't know that we would end up going that route.
Speaker 3:I feel like, too, it's kind of a high take, ryan, with the whole. Buyers don't need buyers agents. And I'll tell you why it's because a thought that ran across my head. It is clickbait for sure, but, phil, I think you would agree to this. If you have one listing agent who's maybe selling 100, 150 homes a year, right, that means he's negotiating 150 times. Now you're asking a normal average Joe, your wife, to go negotiate for your house the biggest asset you ever bought with this guy who negotiates 150 times a year yeah, over and over who's who's gonna win exactly the negotiation.
Speaker 3:You know what I mean.
Speaker 1:That's a fair point yeah, there's so many subtle nuances to a transaction that a lot of people don't really think about like to that, yeah, to that end, you know, like who's gonna really beat you at negotiating when this is all you do for a living right, like it suits, it's harvey specter. And then I roll up and I'm like, come on, harvey, let's do. Well, harvey's gonna destroy me because that's what he does, right? Yeah?
Speaker 2:so, yeah, no, I get, I get that, I get that. So all right yeah, well, my, my idea was stupid no, it wasn't stupid, it's just, it's just another interesting thing, because we see all these changes coming out and we do see agents that are floundering right now and they have that one buyer from their sphere, whatever and they're like I need to make this money to pay off my uh mls fees.
Speaker 2:This and they're in the wrong industry right, and that's where I think we are going to see, hopefully, a weaning of, yes, bad, ages.
Speaker 1:Could not agree more.
Speaker 2:I hope it happens that way, yeah it definitely is something that needs to happen because there's just too many. Yeah, this can't be this many agree, people trying to sell houses? Yeah, um, any other questions, nick?
Speaker 4:yeah, I have a question. So what are some of your daily habits that help contribute to your overall success?
Speaker 1:workout monday through friday um, one at 100 style workouts. Um do, uh, that's where I'm actually going after this. Um, gratitude every morning. 10 minutes of social media like time every morning. 10 minutes of social media, like time every morning. Prayer, a lot of personal focus time. I listen to books or YouTube or podcast. Every. I learned something new every single day, seven days a week. I learned something new every day. I don't even know how to function without that. It's just me. Um, I think that finding way to ways to serve is I've said serve so many times in this like it's who I am, at my absolute core. Just fine, here's a great example.
Speaker 1:My wife called me two times today. I was one time I was shooting videos. I stopped shooting to answer the phone and I was like what's up? I'm in the middle of a shoot, you're on speaker Brian, and everybody can hear you. She's like oh, nothing, I'll talk with you later. It's no big deal, all right, cool.
Speaker 1:The next time I was in a meeting, I said what's up, how you doing? Hey, I'm going to Trader Joe's. Is there anything you want? Yeah, this, this and this. We're good, cool.
Speaker 1:So I call her when I'm on my way here. I say hey, I noticed you call me twice, which she doesn't normally do. She normally texts me because she knows what my schedule is like. My schedule has no white space, it's back to back to back. She knows it. You call me twice and what? Like? What's up? Everything. Okay, yeah, I said so. What did you call for? She said well, the second time was just see if you need anything at trader joe's.
Speaker 1:But the first time there was an accident in front of the office and I was driving by to pick up the kids from school and I noticed there was a young lady and she was really distraught and I wanted to know if you wanted to go outside and help her, because no one was really there helping her. Like, my wife knows how indebted I feel to existence and my way of paying existence back is through service. So she literally called me to stop my day to go outside and just serve a complete stranger. That's what gets me through every single day. Outside and just serve a complete stranger. That's what gets me through every single day, and just accepting that some days are hard, like some days are hard, that's it. But the way you win today is by winning today, not winning every single day. Just win. Today, go to sleep, wake up. Tomorrow, win tomorrow.
Speaker 2:So when you said the couple things you did, I think one of the things that has really, really helped me too is as exercise right, is that piece to it? Um, and I've always worked down. I've always been, you know, going to the gym, this and that. But chase and I are on this journey. We're doing an ironman race and we've been training every single day and some days it's hard to wake up, like it. This morning was a rainy dark. You know we're, we're getting, or?
Speaker 3:it's hard to get in the water when it's super cold. You gotta swim thousand mile like yards yeah, like that.
Speaker 2:That journey to me has helped my mental game in business in life absolutely energy. Um, and I I do feel like that's part of um every entrepreneur's thing if they're missing that piece that it will be so hard to yeah be truly successful when you don't have control of your health. Um so when people always I people say all the time to me, they say I see you working out two hours a day.
Speaker 2:Just wait till you have kids and I said when I have kids, I'm going to be able to do that same amount of thing, because I prioritize that. That's something. If you really wanted it, you will do it. Yeah, and I hate when people say that because I'm like well, what time did you wake up this morning? Because I ran three to five miles before you woke up, and I think that's something. Do people tell you that, like certain things, like, oh well, you do this because you have this?
Speaker 1:My whole life. When I was younger, the older folks, all out of shape, would tell me oh man, you just wait till you're my age. I would love hearing it too, because you're literally the example of what I'll never be when I'm your age.
Speaker 1:Thank you for saying that. So I pay closer attention on what not to do, you know. But to your point, I remember I was doing a training about a year ago and it was about what's important to me and I'm speaking and I was like, well, it's got, and I'm in front of my wife, okay, and I'm like it's God, it's boat, it's wife, it's kids, it's business, and every my wife is there and everyone's like what, this dude's nuts? And I'm looking around and I'm like what, what's going on? Oh, you guys think it's an issue that I put boat in front of my wife. They're like, yeah, you know, that's crazy. You know Victoria, you know what does she think? And I said, well, before you understand what she thinks, let me ask you a question.
Speaker 1:For me, I'm nothing without God. So, knowing that that is my belief, you understand why I put God first. And everyone's like, yeah, got it All right, cool, so we're even there, okay. So the next thing is let me ask you this how good am I for my wife if I'm nothing for myself? Well, you're not good at all. I say great.
Speaker 1:So if I'm in the worst shape of my life, you understand that I can't carry my wife over the threshold. I can't help or pick up the groceries for her or anything, because I'm in the worst shape of my life. Yeah, we get that, phil, all right. If I'm mentally in the worst shape of my life, you realize I can't be there to support her, listen to her and everything else. Yeah, I got that too, all right, great. So you understand if my heart is closed, that I can't be there to listen to her when she needs to lean on me and when she needs to shed. A boat is actually me, it's just the place that allows me to recenter. It's my thing. So, yeah, boat before wife, right, it's my thing, it's my place of peace.
Speaker 2:It's your mask that you put on, before the kid's mask on the airplane. Yeah, dude, exactly, that's exactly what it is yeah, and that that, to me, is something that if you aren't prioritizing that thing whether it's the boat, whether it's your health, whether it's something then you can't truly get to that like next level or like the enlightenment, whatever you want to call exactly if you don't have that piece, and I think we, we struggle.
Speaker 2:We have a group of people that are doing this race with us and we all say the same thing we all struggle to get up. And then we get there and we're like we're happy every time.
Speaker 2:Yeah, man Like we're all talking shit in the chat. If you miss it, you miss a workout, you miss a run. Like you know, there's some accountability there, but that piece is super, super important, having that thing that you're working towards constantly. And, yeah, I think most people that say that they don't have time for something, they just don't want to do it.
Speaker 1:It's an excuse. It's an excuse. I tell people all the time. Like you woke up, I've already had a day. Like that's the fact of the matter. By the time you wake up in the morning. I've experienced an entire day. One of my four days has passed and you're just opening your eyes saying should I hit the snooze button? What if you actually got up when I got up?
Speaker 2:Yeah, the Ed Milet thing I was telling you about this morning on the bike right.
Speaker 2:Dude, crazy Love Ed Milet. He's like I have three days and there's this one guy that does really funny sploofs I'll show you one after this and it's like a motivational guy would be like I have three days. This guy comes up and says some wild stuff, but it's Ed Milet saying like I start my day at like you know, from from 4am to six, whatever it's like. He splits it into three sectors. Right, and as silly as it seems, it is something that you know. You think about it. You're like okay, that makes sense. If somebody wakes up at 8am versus us that wake up at 5 am, we have like a half a work day, yeah, before they even open their eyes.
Speaker 1:Yeah, before their coffee's even born. I mean, that's the true reality of it, like, think of it that way, like if you work six hours, I have worked half of your day and you're asleep. That's come on, and what's the difference? Well, maybe I'm going to bed a little earlier than you, but what have you really done? You watch two extra Netflix shows, so you've done nothing productive. Well, I really need that time. No, you don't. What you need is to increase your bank account so you can go on that vacation with your family, but you're too busy watching Netflix, so you stay up too late, so then you oversleep, so you never actually put in the time and the energy to get better and get great enough so that you can do the things that your family really needs you to do, so you can set the actual benchmarks and and dude, it's. It's just there's so many simple ways to be great and too many people are simply lazy I agree, yeah, I agree, good Nick.
Speaker 4:I have one more question.
Speaker 2:One more question, maybe two.
Speaker 4:Where is your favorite place to take the boat locally? Yeah, how often do you get out on the boat? Good question.
Speaker 1:Definitely so. Me and Mother Nature are in a constant battle. I'll say it I hate Mother Nature. I do.
Speaker 2:I believe Mother Nature Been a windy bay recently.
Speaker 1:Dude, like what is up. Um, so I I take the boat most often to ego alley in downtown annapolis. Um, but I'll go anywhere. I mean, I'll take the boat to st michael's, I'll take it to inner harbor in baltimore, uh do the um, we, we take the boat down to the cambridge hyatt.
Speaker 2:Sometimes you ever been down there.
Speaker 1:I've been to the cambridge I took my old boat to the Cambridge Hyatt. Sometimes you ever been down there. I've been to the Cambridge Hyatt. I took my old boat to the Cambridge Hyatt. I've not taken this boat.
Speaker 2:I'll be doing that next season.
Speaker 1:I'll be taking the boat next year to Queenstown to go golfing. Yes, we've done that too. That's a cool spot.
Speaker 2:I'll have to bring you there.
Speaker 1:That's a great experience out here.
Speaker 2:They pull up. You pull up your boat, you dock and they have your golf cart sitting there All ready.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's really nice. We've done that a couple times, looking forward to that.
Speaker 2:And they have another golf course over in St Michael's the Inn at Perry Cabin. Okay, it's a private course, but they'll let you play and you can do the same thing where you pull up your boat.
Speaker 3:I'll try that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's a good time and we also like to take the boat to Harrington Harbor have you been down there?
Speaker 1:Yep, yep. Harrington Harbor? Yep, definitely, but I'm on the boat, usually A couple places when you come down south.
Speaker 2:He's in the middle. He lives on the water in Middle River. It's just like a little bit further south. I go down south.
Speaker 1:I'll go to the Road River. I go anywhere. I love being on the water. I actually take it to Ego Alley dock, go to Rise Up, get a double shot of espresso and then I just sit and just do my thing. The hard part for me on the boat is a lot of people relax on the boat. It puts me in a hyper state of creativity. So I never go on my boat without my briefcase because I end up working. And it's funny.
Speaker 1:People go party on Saturdays. I don't. I'll go on my boat on Saturday and I just like vibe out and relax. So one Saturday, about four weeks ago, I go out on the water. I go to Eagle Alley. I'm docked up. It's like 4 pm. I just start Okay, I'm working, like my mind's racing, I'm in it, in it, in it.
Speaker 1:These people, this family, comes by. They're having a great time. Hey, what are you doing? I'm working, man, go enjoy yourself. I'm in the vibe. They're like all right, have a great time. So I'm working. It's like one in the morning. Finally I'm like dude back, I start working again because I'm in a project, so I'm feeling good. The same family comes behind their boot. They point this guy's still working. It's just hilarious, but it's just. I love it, man. It just puts me in a really creative space and it's really great. Even this Sunday I was down there and Ego Alley's packed, it's absolutely packed. I get on Instagram, I go Instagram live and I'm like I'm just gonna go live for like 15 minutes. So I'm watching my phone, kid you not this Sunday, I'm watching my phone. 53 minutes later I finished this Instagram live. I look up ego alley is a hundred percent empty. Every boat has left. There's a Harbor master docked next to my boat. It's like hey, bud, you done like yeah, all right, we're trying to get ready for the boat show.
Speaker 1:We need you to leave like dude, I had no idea I'm so sorry, but they were so patient and nice about it, so yeah, but well, I'm usually on there like four or five days a week we'll have to do some, uh, some boating.
Speaker 2:We go down there a good bit. Are you docked down in annapolis where you at bay ridge?
Speaker 1:okay, nice yeah, awesome.
Speaker 2:Well, no more questions, phil. Yeah, we really appreciate you coming on the show and, um, yeah, look forward to uh, getting this one out there and, you know, hopefully do some business together it's a lot of fun and so forth. Yeah, appreciate it thank you glad we got it done. Nick chase, thanks for being here.
